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Thank you Green for your understanding post. I found one point especially interesting: that the people with money will always have access to abortions no matter what. You are right, of course. But did you know that Margaret Sangor, the founder of what is now Planned Parenthood, fought for birth control as a way to limit the amount of black babies being born?? In fact, according to her own writings, she said things like, "Colored people are like human weeds and are to be exterminated." She even addressed the Ku Klux Klan! This fact is always conveniently left out of any mention of her today, but it puts another interesting spin on the abortion issue, I think.

I remember when that magazine came out too! And yes, the stories of women enduring unwanted pregnancies and those having back-alley abortions were heartbreaking. Hearing so much about that made me unsure about the issue: I knew how tough it was to be pregnant when I didn't want to, yet I was happy that I went through with my pregnancy and saw the value in that. But remember that back then, abortion was only legal in the first trimester, and then it got pushed to the second trimester... then it became "on demand", whenever..... and coupled with what I saw as total lack of responsible sexual behavior---using no birth control along with promiscuous and careless sex---I started to feel queasy about the whole issue. It has only gotten worse in my opinion. No longer is abortion just about helping out a desperate or abused girl. It has become about convenience. I absolutely know many, many girls/women who have abortions as a form of birth control, some because they were too lazy to use preventative measures and some because they "just don't like the feel of condoms". A very close friend of mine had 4 abortions in her 30's because of those reasons, and now regrets them terribly. So what is the answer? I would hate to be the one to tell someone in despair that they had to go through with their pregnancy; but I would want to really stress their other options as well as the potential happiness a child could bring them. It is so easy for someone in need to see only problems. But so often problems look insurmountable at first and then become smaller or disappear as we tackle them. I don't believe enough emphasis is placed on the advantages to our lives and our souls when we accept the consequences of our actions and deal with them, instead of trying to get rid of them. I do understand your feelings about your son's upbringing. But remember that adversity can help shape us. Your son saw you doing the right thing. He saw you come through problems and succeed....how you faced things head-on, dealt with them, and continued to be his loving Mom. You gave him wonderful, good stuff along with the tough stuff. He would have some conflicted feelings no matter what simply because he is human. My sons have unpleasant memories of the rough times my DH and I went through.... and I certainly have horrible conflicted feelings about my own parents, especially with the alcoholism. No one escapes tough times, now matter how poor or rich, how settled or unsettled their lives are. I am still happy to be here, and so are my kids. I'm sure yours are too. I think you did the right thing and I am impressed by the smart, open, caring person you appear to be....:eek:

Charsweb: Did you just get a fill?? Why else would you be swollen? Ick, sounds bad. I haven't had a PB (yet), but would really worry if just suddenly I got so tight. If you just got a fill, I'm sure this is just your body's reaction to it and it will go away soon, but if this tightness just came on, please call your doctor!!! Let us know how you are....

Thanks.... I was beginning to worry about my mind. I guess I can hold off on that check-up now...:biggrin1:

You are spot on, Gadget. I had forgotten about that hyper-emotional stage, and it is a powerful one! Thank you for your insightful post.

Hi all: Just wanted to report that I got a fill yesterday that took me to 7cc....and I am finally RESTRICTED!! It is the first real time that I have felt anything like this and I am so happy! I have not been hungry, and it only takes a swallow or two of something to fill me. YEAH!!!! I feel like I have finally entered BandLand!!! :clap2:

Yes, our families were and are Catholic, but very liberal.... my Mom was so upset with me for getting pregnant she didn't talk to me for a week. I suppose I should add that she was a raging alcoholic and was angry at everything then...:cry Our priest knew our situation and was very understanding but the abortion subject was fairly new then and he mostly just listened to me and counseled me instead of condemning what I was planning. By the way, my husband and I are still Catholic, but much more traditional than our families (bet you aren't surprised, huh?) I remember abortion as just becoming legal then.... maybe I am mistaken and it was just that we knew so many girls having them that I am thinking they were, or maybe it was just easier in California. You have now made me question my memory! In any case, both our families were in upheaval and my DH and I were soooooo young and immature. At least your DH wanted you to be pregnant!! Mine was very unhappy and made me feel terrible as if it was MY fault (we both had a lot of growing up to do, but the good news is that we did, especially him...) My DH didn't actually go to Viet Nam. His mother committed suicide shortly after he left and he had to come home and was given a hardship deferment in order to stay nearby to help raise his young sister (his father was also an alcoholic.) We had alot going on in those early years!! BJean, I am a little surprised that you still feel that getting pregnant was one of your worse decisions. Is it because you feel you missed out on something important, or a career got derailed? Or that it impacted your life in a negative way? I know that for me it meant more of a financial struggle and made me become a real adult before I wanted to (and before my friends did), but I think the benefits far outweighed the bad. I am curious as to why, even with your son turning out so well, that you don't feel that same way. I am not prying, just wanting to understand..... And thanks for your input, I do appreciate it

Thank you, Green, for your kindness....

When I was 20 and a brand-new wife, my DH was being drafted for Viet Nam. Even though I was using birth control, I got pregnant. Everyone was upset, including my DH. We had no money and both of our families were going though difficult times and could not help. Abortion had just become legal and I was pressured by everyone around me to get rid of the child because of the hardship it would present for us, especially with my husband gone. A dear priest advised me to think about how much comfort the child would bring me if my husband was killed in the war and what a gift it would be in my life. After much agonizing, I decided to go through with the pregnancy. Best decision I ever made! If I had aborted, the world would have lost the finest, most decent man I have every known (if I do say so myself.... and I never take credit for him, since he was like that from birth). I learned so much from this pregnancy: how to make do with less, how to focus on the humans in my life instead of material things, how to rely on God and His will for me. I also don't think my DH and I would have stayed married all these years if not for this son binding us together during the tough times. Yes, I understand that not everyone has a situation like mine. There are so many tragic stories. But as a Christian, I believe that God will help us though the tragedies if we take the cross He gives us and do the right thing. Thinking of a baby as a "blob of tissue" makes it easy to do what WE think is best, but I can't help thinking of all those potential wonderful people being flushed away. I am not judging those who chose abortion... I remember that desparate, "what do I do now?" feeling and I know that I was alot luckier than many people in that situation---with more options, but I also think that taking the gift God was trying to bring me helped me grow up, make choices that made me a better person and put me on a better path for my life. For people who don't believe in God, I can't expect them to see things in this way, but I do wish that more emphasis would be put on what is being given up and on the help that is out there to get you through. So many people view a nice home or car or clothes as more important... I have even heard someone say their abortion was better for the baby because they "didn't have enough money to give it nice things", as if a baby wants anything beyond it's Mom. That kind of thinking, while hopefully rare, is so sad to me. I don't have an answer but just thought I'd share my story in case anyone else is in the predicament I was in. I volunteered for many years with a church-centered help group that provides clothes, shelter and food for young women who are pregnant and needy. These groups weren't there when I was young, but there are many out there now. I wish they were talked up more as a viable option.

I was banded by the Dr. Kelly Francis of the Le Port group in Fountain Valley. It was a great experience! The hospital they use is wonderful and treated me very well. Dr. Francis and the other doctors are great and very patient. They seem to have a great system....they take the time to make sure you have all your questions asked and are properly prepared, without all the hoops some doctors make you jump through. I live in the Ventura area, but still drive down there for my fills, etc. I was banded last Nov. If you have any questions or would like to chat about it, feel free to send me a private message. I think you will really like Dr. Le Port's team. Good luck! Karen

Gadgetlady: You impress the heck out of me.... for so many reasons. I appreciate the good work you do, the organizations you are involved with and link us to here on LBT, and I admire your willingness to do the "tough work" with your kids. You rock!! :rockon:

Thanks for your nice comments, mrspruett. Yes, the home health-care field is becoming bigger and more necessary all the time. It is very rewarding...one of those "feel good at the end of the day" jobs, MOST of the time.... :guess It also makes it easier for us to find and help the truly needy in our area and to work with local charities. I appreciate the encouragement, thanks!

I think I was just ranting about people, legal and otherwise, taking from the system without giving to it, and then complaining about how bad this country is. If they are going to cheat and steal from programs that are put in place to help people, at least be grateful!! :cry As for getting care for your MIL, you are on the right track with the background checks, etc. Also, never place an ad or take a caregiver from an ad in the newspaper. If possible, use an agency. There are no guarantees, but this will certainly weed out a lot of the bad apples. And be very careful if you decide to offer room and board in exchange for care. Most caregivers in that situation are really only looking for a place to live and aren't really interested in caring for someone. On the other hand, remember that there are a lot of really good and loving caregivers, so don't get discouraged. Just get help in finding them! I'm sure your in-laws will be much happier at home and a good caregiver will insure that. If I can help, let me know!

BJean: P.S. It was Green and I who were briefly discussing corporate greed yesterday..... I didn't challenge you on "making a list" so I am not sure where that is coming from. My post to you yesterday was a nice one about what you had shared as well as telling my "story"..... :nervous

BJean: Congratulations on starting your own business! I have found it so rewarding and it sounds like you are planning good things for everyone involved. Good for you! If you re-read my post, I was referring to the number of people who come into my office looking to make some extra money by working "under the table" to keep from losing their disability/unemployment/housing or supplemental income benefits. The number in 15 years would be at least in the high 100's. And that is just in MY office.... in the years previous to that, I worked at various other agencies and saw the same thing. Unfortunately, the health care industry is a magnet for illegals and also for people who just want to "cheat the system". Since many elderly and other home-bound people need homecare, they are willing to employ anyone who will be willing to do the work. Check out your "help wanted" section in the newspaper. A lot of scam artists and people wanting to stay under the radar answer these ads. Many of these people have full-time jobs that they don't report, and spouses doing the same thing. They make good money doing caregiving; sometimes making $200-300 a day, yet they still get their benefits from the government. That was what I meant by "increasing their wealth". Let me reiterate that I have NO problem with truly needy people getting help, no matter what they need. I just don't like seeing people abusing the system. And to see people complaining about a country or a president (no matter who it is) that gives them the ability to live as well as they do by cheating just irritates me no end.

Maybe you should go visit your in-laws more often (lol) because not only is your post comprehensible, I agree with it TOTALLY! :clap2: You put the whole big/small business thing into a great perspective!!

I think maybe I don't really differentiate between people and corporations. The word "corporation" has become a catch-all for something big, corrupt and impersonal. I think it is more helpful to break it down into people. We need to encourage all people to be responsible and honest in their actions, whether one is an individual or works within a corporation. I do know of some great and ethical corporations, so I think it is possible.

Green, do you actually know people who believe that everyone on welfare is a bum?? If so, that is terrible. In my post, I was talking about people who openly and knowingly exploit the weaknesses in our welfare system to increase their wealth, or to keep from working. There is nothing physically or mentally wrong with them, they just want to get additional income without working for it. On a side note, many of these people are very open with their political views: they hate George Bush because "he hates poor people." Uh, WHAT??

BJean: And I have felt the same about you. I also think we would probably have a great time if we knew each other in person! It's funny how our experiences and relationships can be similiar but shape us in different ways. I live in Calif. so almost everyone around me is liberal/Democrat. I grew up in a family full of Democrats, yet I was always the "sensitive" one, giving strangers my money or my food, picking up "strays", both animal and human, all the time. It drove my parents nuts, and I got many lectures on the need to "toughen up" and take care of myself and stop wasting my life worrying about other people. And I turned out to be the Republican in the family!! To this day, my folks get so angry if they hear about my DH and I doing charity work, especially if it involves money. We try to hide it from them when possible. To most Democrats I know, the focus is on taking care of themselves, while talking about the government's responsibility to take care of everyone else. That never made any sense to me.... I always thought we should take care of those that God brings into our path first, and if all people did that within THEIR circle, we would all be taken care of. Of course, age and wisdom ( ) have shown me that I was thinking in Utopian terms, and I do see the need for government and those that "have" to get more involved in the care of those who "don't have". I think where Dems and Repubs get hung up is on the type or length of care. I know whole families, 2 generations or more, who live on welfare. Able-bodied people but they just don't want to work. Their only "job" is to keep the women pregnant so they can apply for more help. I know that sounds like a mean stereotype, but it is very true and very common. I have been a small-business owner of a medical temp agency for the last 15 years and the amount of people who come in to apply for work, hoping that we will find them clients who will pay them "under the table" so it won't interfere with their welfare/SSI/disability/housing, etc.,etc. benefits would shock you. They come in driving nicer cars than I have, have the latest and trendiest clothes and brag about all the money they spend on the latest toy, with no shame. As someone who has never taken help from anyone, ever, no matter how tough things were sometimes, it makes me angry. Yet in our "politically correct" society, just talking about limiting or policing benefits a little better gets one called a "racist" or "hard-hearted" so most of us don't try anymore. We just watch our tax dollars get wasted and abused, while real needs and really needy people get less. I give all I can to good charities and real people, both in money and hands-on, but I can only do so much..... I guess this is why I get so upset when people talk in stereotypes. I don't think I fit the profile of an Unfeeling Republican, and I don't think you fit the profile of an Unthinking Democrat. I wish everyone had the benefit of a forum like this to exchange views and learn to see each other's side in a non-hostile way. Thanks for sharing yours. P.S. Your Republican friend sounds more radical than anyone I know.... I would love to be a fly on the wall when you two discuss politics!!

Great story!! Although I kinda wish you were still in college so you could "educate" a few more roomates!! :heh:

Is there a difference between the VG band and a 10cc one? I thought they were the same. Can anyone explain?

Well, we found something in common here, BJean: I was a Democrat, born and raised, who switched (I prefer to think of it as "saw the light" ) during Reagan's 2nd term. I even voted for Jimmy Carter ! I don't think my parents have ever gotten over it, though....

Thank you, BJean, for the nice comment. I am glad you and I always find a way to end our "discussions" on a high note!

Great post, GadgetLady!! And thanks for this link.... I much prefer giving in this way and do so with other organizations, but this sounds like an even better way. I'm glad you are there! :clap2:

BJean, I hate jumping back into this, but I just have to straighten out a couple of things: #1 The Clintons presented their health care plan in 1993, with a Democrat-controlled congress. So many people hated it, including most Democrats, that it failed to pass. Sen. Moynihan wrote a scathing critique of it, and so did many other Democrats. Most of my family are liberal Democrats and they hated it too! The plan was 1000 pages and had so many confusing and unworkable aspects to it that the Clintons had to abandon it soon after. So for you or anyone to blame Republicans for the failure is just plain silly and uninformed. #2 If you think that universal health care would be a breeze to implement and run, check out the Canadian LBT threads.... problems there, also! And who on earth needs a $500 million settlement for a botched surgery or anything else? Why must if be all or nothing regarding caps? A reasonable settlement would be punishment for the wrongdoer, compensation for the injured, and keep payouts from affecting the rest of us in our premiums. But again, just saying that makes people scream that it won't be punishment enough. For whom? That is why we can't settle these issues because no one wants to compromise, on both sides. #3 I never said you said the words "evil" or "wicked", it is just that you imply that with every post in which you bring up Republicans. It must be a comfort to be able to blame so many of the country's problems on Bush or the Republican party but I wish for once that you and others could realize that there is 1/2 of this country that doesn't agree with you or how you view many things, so therefore we need to stop speaking as if "our side" is the only one who understands or "feels for" the issues before us. I have never "painted" you with anything and I don't call anyone names. I just called you on your quickness to dismiss an entire political party as uncaring. You speak in generalities and stereotypes when complaining about them and since I am a Republican, I feel included in your stereotypes. I think this is an interesting topic if we can discuss the various problems and ways to compromise on them without playing the blame game. We might actually learn something from each other, and wouldn't that be nice?