Tired_Old_Man

If I tell of all the places where I have had sex, my BW will make sure that I never have sex again.:help: Real Men don't kiss and tell.:faint: Bill Clinton tried to be a real man and look what it got him.:faint::faint: But I guess you ladies can brag all you want.:girl_hug: Talk about double standards.

No. I do not hope the space shuttle blows up today or on it's return, but When Will They Learn? What happened to all the pledges after the first shuttle disaster? What happened to all the pledges after the last shuttle disaster? After each tragedy, there were pledges that schedules would be damned, "safety first" would be the only criteria. I worked as an aircraft mechanic for almost 35 years. We were pressured to keep schedule. The airlines all say that they put safety first, but it is amazing how keeping planes on schedule somehow creeps into the equation. And there is also the human factor of the workers/mechanics/technicians. It is easy for them to get lazy. When they check a system day in and day out and it always checks ok, it is easy to skip a check one time when he is having a bad day, or rushed because of a heavy work load or just thinks that the plane is designed too well to require so many checks or checks so often. But space shuttles are not commercial airliners. Commercial airliners have huge safety factors built in. When they are tested to destruction, they then divide or multiply by various factors in order to get allowable limits. If the manual says that a commercial airliner can only take "x" amount of stress, it can take really take 5x or 6x before it will break. If the manual says that the landing gear must be greased every 2 weeks, it probably can go 2 months without being greased. Space shuttles, on the other hand, are designed on the cutting edge. NASA claims that if tiles are detected broken off, then they will dock at the space station and wait for a rescue shuttle. Yeah, right!! They have no method of repairing tile damage in space. Do you believe that they will leave this multi-billion $ $pace $huttle to rot in space? Why is the schedule to complete the space station more important than the lives of the humans on the shuttle? Why can't NASA come up with a fix? What will happen to the shuttle program, the space station program, our planned trips to the Moon and Mars if the shuttle blows up today or on it's return? I don't want to think about it, but apparently neither does NASA, BUT it is their job to think about it. Their PRIMARY JOB, I would think.

They try again today. Let's pray for their safety.

My BW and I have also tried Ostrich meat and it is not nearly as good as Buffalo meat. "Too dry" in our opinion. But: While we have eaten Buffalo meat in restaurants and prepared it in our own kitchen, where of course we have control over the recipe and ingredients, we have only eaten Ostrich meat in restaurants, where the dryness may have been more a problem of the preparation than the meat itself.

They sell it (among other places) at WAL-MART

Check out This Chart which compares Buffalo Meat with Beef, Chicken, Pork and Salmon.

My wife and I love it. It is not exotic at all. No. I am not going to say, "It tastes just like chicken". It does taste a lot like beef, but leaner. We use it in recipes where-ever beef is called for. Spaghettie and Buffulo Balls is great.

No offense taken. I was "just having fun" when I said I had to be careful what I say because of the comments on my avatar. I can agree as long as we can amend your last statement to say, "just plain...ol'...head and how a woman or man can use her or his mind AND mouth to be very skilled at it." After all, we all started out as females, some of us just changed prior to birth. The clitoris is sometimes referred to as a miniature penis. So much of DevilMayKare's post could be rewritten with "clit" in place of "dick". Even when the anatomical analogies fail, the psychological analogies will still be valid. I am having fun. I can be very serious about having fun. Isn't sex sometimes very serious, but immensely enjoyable. Sometimes writing about your true feelings can be very serious and immensely enjoyable also. If relationships had the same honesty as this thread, many of the problems of the world would be solved. That would be fun.

I agree. It is very hard. But if you put yourself out there, you may be hurt, but you may experience true emotion. If you hold back, can you blame your perspective partner for holding back? Au contraire. I didn't jump on you at all. I said that I don't place blame on anyone. Our society as a whole has become less civil and more commercial. We have standards to live up to that the Greek Gods would have fallen short of. TV and the movies have ruined us to the point of we either have to be as rich as Bill Gates, as strong as Arnold, as Eloquent as George W. or as handsome as Brad. For a woman, I guess Oprah or Angelina Jolie will do. We live in a plastic society, but I personally refuse to be plastic. I have been hurt numerous times, but I would rather be hurt than be so protective of myself and my feelings that I miss out on the relationship that may be waiting for me. Please believe me. I was not attacking you in the least. I loved the letter that you posted. I even e-mailed it to my wife and some female friends of mine. NO. They will never know where it came from. NO. The female friends are not lovers of mine. I do not cheat on my wife.

I can't answer for TommyO, but as another man writing in this thread, I hope I can help answer your question. I said two (of my) posts back meaning: the same way that the letter in DevilMayKare's post describes how a women could or should enjoy giving head is the way that I enjoy myself with a woman's genitalia. I have known many men who place cunnilingus at the top of their list of pleasurable things to do. Some place it #1 for their own pleasure, while some place it that high for the power that it gives them over a woman (at least in their mind). Yes, some men do feel that when a woman is helpless in the throws of orgasmic delight, that the woman is most vulnerable and requires the protection of their macho presence. Some men, perform cunnilingus so that the woman will reciprocate, though they are ambivalent about it. And some men have said, "How can you put your mouth where they pea from?" showing their own lack of caring, lack of sensitivity, lack of anatomical knowledge and lack of grammatical knowledge. Yes, just as women, we men are a diverse group.

I think assigning blame is a waste of time. Most people IMHO fall into one of two categories. Either they are trying to be like everyone else or they are trying to be the opposite of everyone else. We need to spend more time being intimate. I am not speaking sexually necessarily. I am speaking emotionally and intellectually intimate. Too many people are mindless parrots, saying what is expected of them to say. Too many people fall into lust and then rationalize it into love, when a blind person could see that love between the members of that couple is foolhardy. Communication is a lost art. Compare the Lincoln - Douglas debates with the presidential debates of the TV age. How many children can speak openly to their parents? How many parents can speak to their children or to each other? Oh, we all say we can, but down deep most of us are too afraid to be noticed or we go out of our way to be noticed, but when we go out of our way to be noticed, is it really us or some pseudo characterization that is being paraded about? This is a beautiful thread. Somehow, many people have admitted things that they would normally not admit. My wife says that I have a big mouth. My son says that I have a big mouth. They are right. Maybe I don't know enough to be afraid. I definitely don't know enough to place blame.

I have been almost afraid to post anymore in this thread. Between the wonderful advice for women in DevilMayKare's post and the remarks about my avatar, I find it difficult to say anything that will not get me misunderstood and in trouble. I have explained to my past lovers exactly the mirror image of that DevilMayKare post. Many women have found it impossible to understand. Many have admitted, but only during the post love-making hugging and intimacy that they had similar feelings. One of the differences that I have found between the genders is the female's inability to be truthful about their cravings for certain sexual acts. It is hard to blame them, when the act described by DevilMayKare's post is many times used as the ultimate insult in an argument. Usually it is only after orgasm that a woman can be truthful. Men are sometimes left with the cache 22 of a woman who can't be intimate until she has had an orgasm, but who can't have an orgasm until she feels she can be intimate. I guess I have left myself open to be corrected. Since 90% or more of the posters of this thread are female and will claim that they know more about females than any man (especially a Tired_Old_Man) can. Correct me if you must, but try not to criticize too broadly. We are as fragile as you. We crave intimacy as much as you, so don't scare us off.

Very similar to the mastectomy v. lumpectomy situation a few decades ago. While both procedures had the same survival rate, male surgeons were too quick to perform mastectomies. A female friend of mine who's biopsy was positive, could not talk Mr. Doctor into a lumpectomy, nor Mr. second opinion, so she got a female surgeon who could understand and had a lumpectomy 20 years ago.

Maybe the low 24% figure can be explained by noting that women who "actually enjoy it" are too busy to talk to survey takers.

Are you saying that you have toys in your toy-chest?:faint::grouphug:

I do not like lying, but some things are no one's business. I wonder how much hinesty you would have gotten if you had asked Carol an equally personal question on a different subject. I can think of many questions, but for the sake of civility, I will leave you (and the other readers) to assume what I might mean, that would probably not get an honest answer.

OH I didn't want you to think I was going off of your post on that. I was trying to break up the post by saying "ALSO". In this thread, early on, we were talking about BCBS of MA changing their rules and that was what I replying too. That BCBS might just be having the change every where else too. Sorry for the mix up. I didn't think that at all. I was comparing two situations; One, where a responsible insurance company is looking after the best interest of the patient (thought not cutting their own financial throat) and the other situation, in which a medical insurance company is uncaring, irresponsible, foolish, unethical, and maybe criminal in it's actions.

Mona: With a BMI over 60, any insurance company denying bariatric surgery is either foolish, unethical, criminal, or uncaring (or any or all of the above) and deserves to be reported to the state regulators and maybe sued in court. They are gambling that you will die before having to have medical treatments that would eclipse the cost of bariatric surgery. If the Tennessee state insurance regulators will not step in, it is time to write to both your Tennessee state legislators and to your US congressmen. Each person in this country has one state Representative, one state Senator, one US Representative and two US Senators. Not knowing their e-mail addresses is foolishness on the part of any US citizen. US House of Representatives US Senate State Legislatures I noticed that you are a person who believes in the power of God. Many of our elected officials also claim to profess that belief. Let's see if contacting them will get them to prove whether they really are "Pro-Life" or actually "Pro-Big-Business".

Mona, the women in the linked thread is in a totally different situation than the situation that I wrote about in my last post. With a BMI over 60, any insurance company denying bariatric surgery is either foolish, unethical, criminal, or uncaring (or any or all of the above) and deserves to be reported to the state regulators and maybe sued in court. They are gambling that Mona will die before having to have medical treatments that would eclipse the cost of bariatric surgery. If the Tennessee state insurance regulators will not step in, it is time to write to the Tennessee state legislature and to the US congressmen. Each person in this country has one state Representative, one state Senator, one US Representative and two US Senators. Not knowing their e-mail addresses is foolishness on the part of any US citizen. US House of Representatives US Senate State Legislatures

<meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv="CONTENT-TYPE"><title></title><meta content="OpenOffice.org 1.1.0 (Linux)" name="GENERATOR"><meta content="20060627;9191600" name="CREATED"><meta content="16010101;0" name="CHANGED"> <style> <!-- @page { size: 8.27in 11.69in; margin: 0.79in } P { margin-bottom: 0.08in } --> </style> It is difficult to make "honest" posts. I do not want to look like an attack dog, but it is too easy to agree with the person who is complaining, rather than to try to help them. Maybe insurance companies are cheap and want to save money, but sometimes (maybe) they realize that when people go into these things (bariatric surgeries) without proving that they can put in the effort, that they are more likely to be failures. According to the surgeon who put in my Lap-Band, "(as of 2002), the average Lap-Band patient lost 25% of the access weight between their starting weight and the weight that they should be for their height. It was close to 85% for gastric bypass patients ("roux-en-y" and "the Switch")." I have lost 58% of my access weight. My doctor considers me a success. I still weigh 232 at 5'9". According to the charts, I should be about 165#. I would be happy at 180#. I have lost 65% of the weight to get to my goal. BUT: My family looks at me wearing size 44 pants and X-large or 2XL shirts and sees a failure. Strangers who see me on the street snicker and call me fatso (behind my back). People who I do not know, make comments like "How can a big guy like you share a meal with your wife?" Weight loss is not easy. TV shows highlight the success of big stars. The doctors tell you the statistics, but then paint a picture (with your help) of the wonders of weight loss surgery. They mention the possibilities of complications, but then move right on to the benefits that you are going to have. But they never forget to get you to sign the forms about the dangers. Insurance companies are full of business people who know the stats. They know how much it is going to cost them paying for the treatment of the medical complications of obesity. They compare that cost with the cost of bariatric surgery and its complications. They are cold-hearted businessmen. But the stats that they use also protect you. More money out of the insurance company's pocket also means more heartache for you, the patient. My BMI was about 48. I had tried many techniques to lose weight and always did, but then gained more weight back. I was 57 years old when I got my Lap-Band. We had the pre-surgery candidates come into our post surgery emotional counselling sessions quite often. Once we had a 17 year old girl who was close to 300 pounds at about 5'6" come in. She was going to have either the "roux-en-y" or "the Switch". I suggested to her that she have a Lap-Band because neither the "roux-en-y" nor "the Switch" are reversible and at her young age, there may be better alternatives around the corner (with the research into ghrelin and other enzymes). No. She had to have the "roux-en-y" or "the Switch". It was her decision, but isn't 17 year old a little young to give up? I wish everyone who has these invasive techniques, "the best". I wish we could get to the root cause of the problem for all this weight gain in the USA. But, until then, we need to try everything short of surgery first. Not half-hearted, to get it out of the way, in order to speed up the insurance company's approval, but to try to get it to work. As I said in another post, I know of people who purposely gained weight in order to meet their insurance company's criteria for bariatric surgery. I think that is sick. But I am no psychologist, so I guess I have no right to talk.

You can tell me to shut up if you wish and to mind my business, but I sense in you a feeling that the lap-band is going to make everything better without any work on your part. You seem to have given up. $11,000 is a lot of money. Try the 6 month diet if that is required. Try Hoodia. Try Atkins again. If you think Atkins is restrictive, then the Lap-Band is going to be a failure. Atkins is a piece of cake as compared to the Lap-Band. A Lap-Band is major surgery. People can die from major surgery. People have died from Bariactric surgeries, including Lap-Bands and complications from Lap-Bands. Neither Atkins, Hoodia or a 6 month supervised diet can kill you. People need to realize that this Lap-Band is not an easy way out. If you think I am out of place, well I am sorry. But as a person who has had a Lap-Band for almost 4 years and is counted as a success, but still 60 pounds over-weight, I just want you to take full advantage of every option.

My BMI was over 48 and I had diabetes, plus heart and blood-pressure problems, so my approval took less than a month in 2002. Since then, however, my medical plan has removed bariatric surgery from it's list of covered surgeries. My daughter-in-law's mother had to gain about 30 pounds to become eligible for her policy's approval. Maybe one day, our disease will be treated like most other diseases. Alcoholism, drug addiction, mental illness and morbid obesity are all treated as step-children in the medical insurance industry.

My first job was as a coffee-boy and food server back in 1962 (between high school and college). The next summer, I worked as a truck loader for the 7-Up soda company. Then I dropped out of school and worked as an installer for the NY Telephone company. I went back to school and dropped out again to be a Rock & Roll Band and Go-Go Girl manager for a few years. When many of the musicians of my 3 bands got drafted and "Topless" came out discouraging 6 or my 7 dancers, I went to work for a major airline as an Electronics mechanic which I stayed at for almost 35 years. I also found time to load and drive fresh chicken trucks for three weeks between the Rock & Roll/Go-Go girl gig and the airline job. I worked part time driving a delivery truck for about 7 years while working the airline job, spent some time working in a junk yard (auto scrap yard) cutting up vehicles, drove a taxi on week-ends for a while and then I had a business on the side fixing cars for airline cabin attendants for about 10 years while working for the airline. After retiring from the aircraft machanics job in 2001 and moving to Florida in 2003, I worked for about 8 months for a major home-improvement retail chain. That's about it.

By the way, if anyone ever feels intimidated by a doctor, just remember this story: A world renowned surgeon who died suddenly in a terrible car accident awoke to find himself on a cloud. He saw a long line and he asked an angel flying by, "what is the lines for?" The angel told the doctor that the line lead to the entrance to Heaven. Being disoriented but curious, he walked around taking in the wondrous sights from the outside. He marveled at the pearly gates, as well as the streets paved with gold. After a while, he decided that he had better get on line, but he found that the line was over a mile long when he took his place at the end. The line was progressing very slowly when a limo pulled up in front and discharged a man with a great beard and carrying two stone tablets who went in ahead of everyone else. The surgeon became angry and tapped the person in front of him on the shoulder and asked, "who is that?" The person in front of him replied that it was Moses, the bringer of law. This satisfied the doctor for the present. A few hours later, another limo pulled up and discharged a fellow wearing purple robes and carrying a staff who also went in ahead of the rest. The surgeon again was irritated and asked the person in front of him who that arrival was, and was told that it was Pope John-Paul the 2nd! This also satisfied the surgeon for a short time. After another long period of time, a sports car pulled up in front and a man carrying a black bag, wearing surgical scrubs, went in ahead of the rest, which infuriated the world renowned surgeon who yelled in exasperation, "that is a doctor and he can't be any more famous than me, so just who the hell is that?" This time the whole line answered in unison, "Oh, that's God! He just thinks that he is a doctor!"

To the patients in that group who's free fills may be cut off early: You are that doctors free advertising. He needs your "word of mouth" to spread through the community to bring in more bariatric patients. More importantly, he doesn't need people talking about him reneging on promises, whether he can do it contractually or not. Get together and give him an ultimatum. I hope all the complications of his patients are being handled at his expense. Just my 2¢ worth.