Tired_Old_Man

The right-wing is already smearing Obama and blaming the smear on Hillary. I have gotten e-mail with the same smear (which has been debunked by CNN and WABC) and ending with: "If you do not want Hussein in the White house, pass this on."

Green: Unlike the Parrot joke, your joke required the person to be Jewish.

The President's E-mail is: comments@whitehouse.gov You can go to http://www.house.gov/ to find out your Representative's e-mail address or contact method. You can go to http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm to find out your Senator's e-mail address or contact method.

You don't need no stinking rights:faint:

To all LBT members: I wrote two perspective letters for e-mailing the president. Which if any of the two perspective letters to the president do you like best? #1: Mr. President: You have repeatedly stated what you see as the disastrous outcome for Iraq and the Middle-East if the US Military leaves Iraq before “the job is done”. You have stated that this outcome is not acceptable to the US government. You have also said that you told Prime Minister Maliki that the US commitment is not “Open Ended”. These are two contradictory statements. If the US can not leave until the job is done, they it must be an open ended commitment, because no one knows when the job will, if ever, be done. If your commitment is not open ended, then when will you know when to leave? And will the disastrous outcome for Iraq and the Middle-East that you have predicted then be acceptable? * OR #2: Mr. President: You have painted a drastic picture for Iraq and the Middle-East if we leave Iraq now, yet you say, "Our commitment is not open ended". Which way is it? If the leadership of Iraq does not respond, will you leave? And what happens then? If you really believe your drastic predictions, then you must also say, "I will never leave Iraq". But, if our commitment in Iraq is "not open ended", then lets start a redeployment now. Why wait for more of our soldiers to die in Iraq's civil war? * I will be sending out suggestions to over a 100 people via e-mail to send the selected letter to the president and to ask their congressmen to ask the same question. BTW. Anyone here who wants to use either of the two perspective letters for e-mailing the president, I hope would feel free to do so. TOM

I have posted a few times today. I understand how people can lose their cool when someone is so cock sure of them self. I am not perfect either, in fact quite far from it. I am not an alcoholic, but I have gone to "12 step" meetings and all I can say is to try to do right one day at a time. If you are having trouble being good one day, then try to be good for one hour. If that is too difficult, then try one minute. If all else fails, walk away for a while. "Time out" works good for adults, too. Another "12 step" lesson is that when you do fail, get right back on the wagon. This process is important whether we are talking about alcohol, drugs, eating, codependency, brutality (verbal or physical) or anything else that they have programs for (or even for things we need to control that they have no programs for). You are a good person. Most of us here at LBT are good people (even the Republicans:faint:) and we all make mistakes, except God, Allah, Jesus, etc.:faint:

Has anyone seen the TV spot that says that many seniors are now saving money on their Rx drugs and we should not tamper with the Medicare Rx program? They are already attacking the Medicare Rx Negotiation bill before the Senate gets it. How come Medicare negotiates doctor's fees for Medicare recipients? Let the lobbying begin!!

I agree. But Hillary for President and Obama for VP, might keep Hillary alive.

Not all Muslims go to Madrasas. Many of the Madrasas that do teach anti-Israeli and anti-USA philosophies are in countries that are our allies. Pakistan claims it does not have the money to build public schools that would stamp out the need for Madrasas. If the USA gave Pakistan the money it wastes in one week making enemies in Iraq, Pakistan could build non-indoctrinating public schools and shut down the Madrasas. The USA would then have been better off saving the money and bloodshed it wasted on the Illogical Illegal Iraqi Invasion and would be helping to make a better future for Pakistan, Pakistan's people and for itself. Why Saudi Arabia has Madrasas is beyond money, but why doesn't someone in the US government put pressure on the Saudis to crack down? Could it be that because Ronald Reagan killed all of Jimmy Carter's "Alternative Fuel" programs that the USA has no guts to insist that our allies help us? Can you spell O-I-L? The Geneva Conventions were written by countries who could afford conventional warfare, so they wrote the rules for themselves. However, the USA is supposed to be the (self-professed) guiding light and to use torture and other forms of human rights violations is a despicable chapter in our history. When Thomas Jefferson wrote "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness" he didn't say, "that all men in uniforms are created equal" nor "that all men who are US citizens are created equal". President BuSh swore (at his inaugurations) to defend the Constitution of the United states of America. That includes: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness". The Geneva Conventions must be acceptable to our constitutional guidelines to be ratified by the USA. That's what the fight in congress was all about last year.

When In Doubt, Start Another Civil War Why Bush is Selling Arms to Fatah By CHRISTOPHER BRAUCHLI There's one thing George Bush knows. You don't get to be the biggest arms merchant in the world by only selling arms to friends. If that were the case the only countries to which we'd sell arms would be countries like Great Britain and Canada and they're not going to buy enough to keep us in first place. And it's not Mr. Bush's fault that he doesn't know that there is a history in the United States of selling arms to people who have ended up using the arms against the United States. After all, it's hard enough for him to keep up with what's going on right now. If he knew history, he'd know that in the 1980s the United States sold Iran 12,000 anti-tank missiles, 235 Hawk missiles and 200 Phoenix air-to-air missiles costing more than $1 million each. He'd recall that when we thought Mr. bin Laden was our friend for trying to kick the Soviets out of Afghanistan (a country to which we are now bringing law and order in order to show the Russians how good old American know-how can get the job done) we provided him with stinger missiles. The ones bin Laden couldn't use he sold to Iran and got cash that has helped in his ongoing battle with his former arms supplier). Now Mr. Bush is arming the Palestinian organization known as Fatah. President Mahmoud Abbas is a member of the Fatah party and the president of the Palestinian Authority. He was elected in 2005 and until 2006 Fatah controlled the Palestinian Authority. Some parts of Fatah get along with Israel-sort of. In 2006 legislative elections were held. Hamas won and took control of parliament. Fatah cabinet members resigned and were replaced by Hamas members. Hamas does not get along with Israel. It wants it removed from the face of the earth. Since the elections, relations between Fatah and Hamas have been tense and often violent. The two groups have tried unsuccessfully to form a unity government and since that failed have resorted to shooting at one another in the streets. Mr. Bush is very concerned about the destabilizing effect a full-scale conflict between the two groups could have on the region. He fears it could turn into another Iraq. One way of dealing with the concern would be for him to initiate talks with the two groups and see if there is a way forward that would protect Israel's right to exist while at the same time eliminating the risk of civil war between Hamas and Fatah. That is impossible because the United States (and Israel for that matter) do not talk to groups that are dedicated to the destruction of Israel. Mr. Bush also doesn't talk to countries he doesn't like but that's another story. Ever creative, Mr. Bush has another plan. Sell arms. Mr. Bush is going to pour $86 million into the coffers of Fatah. That is more than the total of all the monies the United States has given the PLO since it was formed in 1994. None of this aid would be necessary if Fatah had not lost the 2006 election. The money will help it regain what it lost at the ballot box. Mr. Bush understands that kind of thinking since he had to go the Supreme Court to become president after losing at the ballot box. According to media reports in late December, with Israel's and the United States's approval, 2,000 AK-47s and two million bullets were transferred to Mr. Abbas's security forces, many of whom are loyal to Mr. Abbas and to Fatah. (Fatah's armed wing known as Al-Aqsa fighters are hostile to Israel and some Fatah folk have launched terrorist attacks against both the U.S and Israel but Mr. Bush hopes those people won't be given those weapons.) With $86 million it's a sure bet there will be lots more weapons heading Fatah's way. More arms is a sure fire way to bring peace to that region. There is, of course, always the chance that the arms being sold will eventually be used against the merchant (us) or even Israel. That is because there are people loyal to Fatah who dislike Israel. Bassam Eid, head of the Palestinian Rights Monitoring Group in East Jerusalem says the Fatah faction is not a moderate movement and that the infusion of cash will "double the number of thugs" in Fatah. Dennis Roth, a Middle East advisor to two administrations said: "The $86 million reflects the basic sense in the administration that the only way to change things is through confrontation." That is not surprising. Bullies are usually inarticulate and prefer a show of force to a show of brains, especially when not possessed of the latter. Mr. Bush is their poster child.

A Muslim Parrot Three Muslim sons left home, went out on their own and prospered. Getting back together, they discussed the gifts that they were able to give to their elderly mother. The first said, "I built a big house for our mother." The second said, "I sent her a Mercedes with a driver." The third said, "I've got you both beat. You know how Mom enjoys reading the Holy Qur'an and you know she can't see very well? I sent her a large brown parrot that can recite the entire Holy Qur'an. It took twenty Imams 12 years to teach him. I had to pledge to contribute $1,000,000 a year for twenty years but it was worth it. Mom just has to name the Surah and verse and the parrot will recite it." Soon thereafter, Mom sent out her letters of thanks. She wrote to the first son, "Omar, the house you built is so huge. I live in only one room, but I have to clean the whole house." She wrote to the second son, "Hussein, I am too old to travel. I stay home all the time, so I never use the Mercedes and the driver is SO rude." She wrote to the third son, "Dearest Mohammed, you were the only son to have the good sense to know what your mother likes. The chicken was delicious."

A Christian Parrot Three Christian sons left home, went out on their own and prospered. Getting back together, they discussed the gifts that they were able to give to their elderly mother. The first said, "I built a big house for our mother." The second said, "I sent her a Mercedes with a driver." The third said, "I've got you both beat. You know how Mom enjoys reading the Bible and you know she can't see very well? I sent her a large brown parrot that can recite the entire Bible. It took twenty ministers 12 years to teach him. I had to pledge to contribute $1,000,000 a year for twenty years but it was worth it. Mom just has to name the chapter and verse and the parrot will recite it." Soon thereafter, Mom sent out her letters of thanks. She wrote to the first son, "Martin, the house you built is so huge. I live in only one room, but I have to clean the whole house." She wrote to the second son, "Mitchel, I am too old to travel. I stay home all the time, so I never use the Mercedes and the driver is SO rude." She wrote to the third son, "Dearest Michael, you were the only son to have the good sense to know what your mother likes. The chicken was delicious."

I posted earlier in this tread about a meeting I had with a group of Christians (we used to call them "Protestants") last year after my minister gave a guest sermon at a church before an interdenominational group representing about a dozen different denominations. I spoke to about 10 people as we were enjoying cake and coffee after the service. Each was of a different denomination and I don't believe any was a from a Messianic (I hope I spelled that correctly) church. Each of the 10 told me that his way of worshiping the "One and Only True God of the Bible" was the only way to enter the "Kingdom of Heaven". Each and everyone of them was just as sure as Reverend Cusano that only the people who worshiped in their denomination (or their way) would make it into Heaven and all the others would not. They were each also sure that neither my minister (nor me, of course) nor Jews, nor Roman Catholics would enter the "Kingdom of Heaven". In fact, I should not have said "Each and everyone of them was just as sure as Reverend Cusano that only the people who worshiped in their denomination (or their way) would make it into Heaven and all the others would not". I should have said "Each and everyone of them knew beyond any doubt as Reverend Cusano knows beyond any doubt that only the people who worshiped in their denomination (or their way) would make it into Heaven and all the others would not". And there is the crux of the problem. How can 10 people (actually 10 groups) all KNOW opposite things? Each claims it is his faith that makes him sure. But one does not need faith to be sure 1 + 1 is 2. When you know something, you do not need faith. When you have to have faith, you do not know. These people are all substituting the word "KNOW" for the phrase "sure because of (my) faith". I was raised in a mixed family of Roman Catholics and Pentecostals. I played, as a child with the child who became Jessica Hahn's minister (when she had the infamous affair with Jim Bakker). My grandparents were renowned at a dozen Pentecostal churches throughout Brooklyn, and Nassau and Suffolk counties on Long Island. Every Sunday, a different Pentecostal minister was invited to dinner and their trophy was converting me from Roman Catholic to Pentecostal so that they could save Sister Rose's and Brother Paul's grandson. I am no longer a Roman Catholic, but after being agnostic for many years, I now belong to a church that doesn't force one vision of God down our throats, but instead tries to stress the teachings of Jesus Christ. Trying to emulate Jesus instead of trying to emulate Constantine makes me a better person and I don't care if anyone says that I will go to Hell because I don't do it their way. At that meeting that I was writing of at the beginning of this post, my minister was speaking to a women during the post sermon cake and coffee session, and she became very belligerent about his sermon. She was annoyed because my minister said that Jesus wanted to help the poor, but she said that she would vote for congressmen who would keep her tax dollars out of programs like Medicaid and “Food Stamps” And she knew what Jesus said because she was also a Minister. Funny how many people can read the same bible and come away with totally different ideas. Maybe when Constantine had the bible canonized, the selection commission didn't do quite the job that many Christians think they did.

Another way to support our troops until we get BuSh to remove them from harm's way is to give them the best protection possible. Why is the US Army stopping Deployment of an anti-Rocket Propelled Grenade system? Is the Army stopping the deployment of the Israeli developed "Trophy" anti-RPG system so that Ratheon can keep its $70,000,000 contract to deploy an anti-RPG system by 2011, when Trophy is ready now and has been ready since 2004?

At 1,200 Pounds, I doubt it. I wish this man the best of luck, but he will need more than a diet IMHO.

My wife has been visiting her mother in Brooklyn for the past two weeks and so, of course, I overdid it here at LBT. So I am going on a vacation (from posting) to catch up on the housework. I have been doing my share of the work, some of her share and have had to baby sit my 6 year old grand-daughter Brooklyn, but my wife is going to expect a lot more to be accomplished when she gets home Tuesday, so I had better get to work. I have to get in the shower to get ready for church, go to church and then come home to start laundry, dishes, etc. Bye. I will miss my many friends and even those that don't like my "w:rolleyes:rds of wisd:rolleyes:m".

Telling someone that you feel like you are in Sodom while here, saying that atheists came crawling out of the woodwork, and comparing some with "thieves, liars, murderers and yes, even bigots", sounds like assailing to me. The Anger of Jesus shown while money changers were desecrating a temple does not equate with your abusive innuendo while debating on-line.

Did Jesus teach to respond to an aggressive manner with more aggression, or was "turning the other cheek" something made up by a religious zealot?

The "Holy Qur'an" does not challenge the existence of Jesus. The "Holy Qur'an" equates Moses, Noah and Jesus as people sent by God to teach the people of their time the constant rules of how God wants his children to behave. Martin Luther King Jr. also did that and led my example as all the others mentioned did. They were all great men, and their greatness did not depend on any of them being a Deity or a son of a Deity, although we are all sons (or daughters) of a Deity.

You will have to take my word for it, but I said in 2002, during the buildup to the Illogical Illegal Iraqi Invasion, that even if not one member of the US Military is killed in Iraq, the war would be wrong. Many Americans only want out becaus,e we are losing people (and money). It is better than being stubborn and wanting to stay, but wanting out for that reason is not morally defendable.

Just about everything we build is offesive. In ancient Rome, soldiers had swords for offense and shields for defense. Today, we build weapons for attacking, not defending. I am not placing blame on any particular US regime, I am placing the blame on all who since the cold-war allegedly ended have spent very little on learning Arabic, farce or much of anything else about Muslims or their history or culture. That was not the first in the chain of attacks and counter-attacks between the West and Muslims. It was not even a surprize attack. We had bombed them and Bin Laden had declared war on us many years earlier. It was part of an ongoing war that we never tried to mediate by talking with the countries of the Middle-East. [ When the USA bombs cities, there are hundreds of buildings destroyed, some of which are hospitals, restaurants, etc. [ We also station troops and/or support the restrictive governements that squash the freedom of their people. Sweden buys oil on the open market but does not prop up the government od Saudi Arabia. The price of oil dropped because Iraq and Iran got into a war with each other and to afford the war, they each sold much more than their OPEC quota of oil, driving the price down (and US inflation down which Reagan took credit for). The Iraq issue is not entirely oil, but mostly oil related. That was a rhetorical question to show that BuSh was full of BS about his need for Democracy in Iraq. It was an excuse. He knew there were no WMD, nor did Hussein have anything to do with 911, but he attacked anyway. As long as the USA has this air of being Jesus' chosen country, no matter who is president, we will not make allies in the UN. As long as we support Israel, no matter what policy they employ, we will have problems in the UN. We can not expect fairness when we are in the right, if we act unfairly when we are in the wrong. It is our attitude, not our people that much of the world hates.

Point #3 When writing a computer program, some programmers leave instructions in even after they have been found to be no longer valid. They put a special character at the start of each line of code that basically says, “Ignore this next instruction”. When updating (Microsoft) Windows, by removing old programs (applications) and replacing them with new programs (applications) or updated versions of the same programs, remnants of the old instructions are left in the “Registry” which is a data-base of instructions for making Windows work. There are also remnants left in the Registry when we make a mistake while installing a program, even after we uninstall that program. There are programs that we can download called “Registry Cleaners” that can remove all the unused and unneeded remnants of the old applications and old installations. If, however, Registry Cleaners are not used, a computer expert who specializes in the Windows Registry can analyze a registry and tell what programs have previously been installed and removed. Well, if God invented DNA, he apparently did not bother to invent a DNA Cleaner, because scientists who are experts on the Registry of life, DNA, can see the remnants of all the attempts of that DNA to program life. Just as the computer programmer leaves in steps which are no longer valid, and puts a special character at the start of each line of code that basically says, “Ignore this next instruction” the majority of DNA has coding which says, “Ignore this next instruction”. That is why the scientists find turned off instructions for webs between toes and finger, tails and many other things in human DNA. That is why some people have bunions, because the instruction for having an opposing thumb on their feet were not totally turned off. Those remnants also verify many of Darwin's predictions base on empirical observations. The theory of evolution is not perfect and is itself evolving, but the percentage of “guesses” that Darwin and advocates of his theory have been too high to have been guesses. It was science. If God made man in his own image, why did he leave all the instructions for other animals' parts in our DNA?

Point #2 The stars we see at night are billions of light years away. The light we see from star A which is 10 billion light years away was created 10 billion years ago. When astronomers see a star that is 15 billion light years away, explode, that explosion happened 15 billion years ago. How can the Heavens and Earth be only 6,000 years old if that explosion was 15 billion years ago? How do we know how far away the stars are? By scientific measurements. How do we know the measurement are correct? Because when we send satellites into space, they get to their intended destinations within seconds of the calculated time for the distance that was scientifically measured. If they got there too early, the computer could not have made the next course correction. By the way, I wrote this without any bashing, without going to any websites and without stretching any points.

Point #1 If there was Intelligent Design, why did the "Designer" not give his greatest work the best? The human eye is nowhere near the top of the list of eyes. Many animals see better than humans. Same goes for the human ear. Same goes for the ability to protect and hunt with smell. Why don't humans have SONAR or RADAR like whales and bats for guidance? Why don't humans have guidance systems like birds to navigate the planet? The human being is probably one of the weakest animals pound for pound of all the animals on the planet. I guess the Designer only cared about the brain. Is that why we call it "Intelligent Design"; because only intelligence was designed? If man was created in the image of God, why is he so defective? Wouldn't god have given the best of everything; eyes, ears, etc.? If man is created in God's image, is God also defective? Why did God have a penis? But more importantly, why did God have a nose? Does God need air? Where was the air? How does God breath in space? Why does God need eyes? Does not he have the ability to see what is invisible and what is in my heart and mind? Why does God have ears? Can't he hear what is in my mind? Why does God have a mouth? Can't he put words into my mind that no one else can hear? How would his voice be transmitted without air between Heaven and Earth? Does He need a mouth to eat? What does He eat? What did He eat before He created all the things that He would be able to eat? Before Genesis, I mean? My point is that if we are created in God's image, why did God have all these unneeded parts? Many might see this as mocking God. No, it is asking intelligent questions with the one thing that the Creationists or Intelligent Design advocates agree that humans have the best of; MY BRAIN. By the way, I wrote this without any bashing, without going to any websites and without stretching any points.

Then why didn't you tell them that no one is bashing anyone here? Can't they read that for themselves? No name calling, just honest debate.