pattygreen

All I can say is "One day we shall see." The scripture teaches that in the end of time "every knee WILL bow and every tonge WLL confess that Jesus Christ is Lord." He is our creator and when He says something is right or something is wrong, it would be best for everyone if we heeded his advice. Just a note* It is one thing to say you are a christian, the real test of that is when you follow His teachings. Therefore, you can't be a christian and say it's ok to kill a baby in the womb or out of the womb. Killing is wrong.

I've already spoken on the forgiveness of God in my past post. You are right when you say God forgives. And you are right that the Gov. shouldn't have to make this decision for us. It should be a given. To take another life is wrong. Why can't people see that? But the gov. needs to step in and abolish abortions because babies are being destroyed by the millions. We don't mind the gov. making other laws for us to protect us from harm. Why shouldn't they also protect the innocent ones in the womb?

well, she obviously feels that God is her God. She prays to him and reads what he has to say.

Not true. God does not support his children in every decision that they make in life. Only the right decisions. Just like you as a parent would not support your child's decision to use drugs.(or at least I hope not) Also, if you have read the bible twice, then you would have read the story in the old testament of a person who killed the baby in the womb of a pregnant woman and God gave him the death penalty for it. He does not approve of harming the unborn child in any way.

and by the way, I have never stood at an abortion clinic to protest abortions. And just because some christians have done that, it isn't fair to put all of us in the same category as 'radical'.

Let me first say that When Obama tells me that he supports a womans right to choose, he is talking about choosing to kill your unborn baby or choosing to deliver it alive and either keep it or give it up for adoption. So, him supporting the right to choose means YES, he will allow you to murder your unborn children. Period!!! Marriage is: A God ordained institution between one man and one woman where they say vows before Him. God instituted marriage and defined it in that way. If you don't like his definition of marriage, then your problem is with Him, not me. Homosexuals may do as they please, but changing the definition of what a marriage is supposed to be is wrong. Like I said before, call it a civil union or anything else you like. If God had not set up the first set of laws to follow (the 10 Commandments), man would not know what a law was. Someone has to have the ultimate authority to dictate what should be allowed or not. And that someone is God. If he did not say 'Thou shalt not murder', who's to say you can't? For instance, both you and I disagree about abortion rights. Who can settle this debate? God can. And He can settle every debate out there. This country was founded by our CHRISTIAN forefathers, who came here from England so that they could worship God freely. The same God I still serve today. I'm sorry if you or your family drifted away from that God as time in this country went on, but some of us haven't. Now, as far as the 14 year old who was raped and had the abortion goes. You are right when you say that Jesus would feel compassion for her and love and comfort her through it. But you are wrong if you think he would have accepted getting an abortion as the way out of it. He would have told her that in this wicked world in which we live, people do all kinds of evil things to others such as rape. It isn't right, but it happens none the less. He would have told her that he loves her, and that he also loves the innocent new life inside her and that it too is a victim here. He would have told her to carry the child and deliver the child and know that none of this is her fault or the child's fault, but that to kill the baby through an abortion is a sin. That's what he would have told her. Now this girl is no longer 14 years old. This is what I believe He would tell her now. "My child, when that happened to you when you were young, you didn't know what to do, and I understand that at the time you were confused and young and hurt and abused unjustly. I want you to know that I forgive you for making the choice to have an abortion. I love you." That's what he would say now, if she asks him for forgiveness. God knows that we go through this life and make wrong choices and decisions every day. That's why he sent Jesus.

I did not shame her or chastise her. I truely feel compassion for what she's been through, but that does not mean that I feel how she 'resolved' her problem was right. She is posting on a thread where we are debating abortion, she has to expect opposition to her choice. Sometimes people don't want to hear what might hurt them, but this is how we grow. Who supports the right to choose? Not me.

Steve, well said.

There is a large differnce in 'giving' what you have to those in need, and the government 'taking' what you have to give to those in need.

Did I attack you????? What strong words did I use???? Who did I judge??? I understand that Jesus is not everyones God. But He is mine. And I believe I should be able to express my views on Obama and why I feel he is not a man of character just like the rest of you do. As far as I'm concerned, I don't make the rules , God does. If His laws offended someone here, then their problem is with Him, not me. I believe in God and therefore, I try my best to abide by what He says is right. I'm not perfect. I have found that people get so bent out of shape when you tell them what GOD has to say on any issue (as if they were my own laws and not His) I guess it's just hard to hear what you don't want to hear from the one who Created us. Because if you say you believe in God, you would then have to obey him, and people just want to live the way they want to. If you don't believe in God, well, that's your choice too.

God wants people to help those who aren't able to help themselves, but he wants those who can work to help themselves.He said in 2 Thess. 3:10 "if a man shall not work, he shall not eat." When Jesus told the man to go and sell all that he had and feed the poor, he was trying to teach about how hard it is for the rich man to enter heaven. The rich man was thinking in terms of earning righteousness to inherit eternal life but Jesus taught that it was a gift to be recieved. He wasn't telling us to sell all our posessions and give it away.

Welcome! It looks like you are averaging a pound and a half per week. That's great! Keep up your good work.

I am sorry so to hear your story. What you had to endure was awful and it wasn't right. You were very young and scared I'm sure. It also wasn't your fault that it happened. I would say the same thing to your unborn baby. It was not his fault that his mom was raped and because of that, he was aborted. But I still feel that 2 wrongs don't make a right. It was wrong for that person to impose his power on you, and it was wrong for you to impose your power on your baby. I know that you can't go back and change your decision, but you can learn from it. Life is precious. God tells us that it is wrong to kill the life that grows inside a woman, and I believe Him. (after all, He is the one who created man, so he makes the rules) Saying this to you is hard for me, because I have compassion for you because of your circumstance. But, it must be said. To abort a baby is not right, in any circumstance. Women have choices. They can give their child to a family that wants one. I know that after going through a rape, carrying a baby for 9 months is a long time and all of the sacrifices and emotional turmoil you would have to endure would be hard, but the only other alternative is killing the child. In our society, that should never be an acceptable option. (the wrong doings of others (in this case, your rapist) affect everyone around us, and we sometimes have to endure hard times because of the bad actions of others. We live in a world where there is no escaping the consequences of others wrong doings.) I would never stand in front of an abortion clinic and do that, but If I ever came across someone who was contemplating an abortion (and I have) I would do my best to try to talk them out of it.

I think it is a fabulous thing to have a man of color reach the goal of president in this country. I am so happy to get over the hurdle of racism, and hope this puts an end to it. On the other hand, I am so sad that our new president elect does not have a care in the world for the rights of the unborn children, and supports murdering them. I am also sad that he desires to change what God deemed marriage to be. (between a man and a woman) He wants to take away our rights to bear arms. (and if he does that, then only the criminals and the government will have them. Watch out!) He wants all of us to pay for health insurance for those who won't. (God said 'if you don't work, you don't eat' Period!) He Lied so many times, he can't be trusted.( go to the thread entitled 'why are you voting for Obama?' 1st post, and you won't believe the long list of proven lies he has made.) He will enforce the wealthy to give to the poor. (there goes free enterprise!) When the people in the world begin to look to any one man to be their 'savior', instead of Jesus, God exits the picture. I am bitter sweet about this election. Happy for the african american's victory in making history, but sad that the man will probably not be the kind who will open each day with prayer to God for gudiance and wisdom to do his job. (I say this because his stand on many issues are not God's stand on them). Still, I hope and pray that God will Bless America.

I think it is fabulous that a black man can achieve the position of president. (or any color man for that matter) I only hoped that a black man of character (or any man of character for that matter) would get that position. The celebration of seeing the day when a family of color lives in the White House to me is exceptional. It isn't good, though, when we see people praising or practically worshiping Him (or anyone) as the Savior of our country. He is not the Savior. In his speach, he made certain to mention that it will be a year or even a full term before you can see his promises, and people are pinning their hopes on him. We give the president of the US alot of power that he just doesn't have. (Jesus alone is the Savior, and when we start looking to others for our help, God turns away.) He made alot of promises to the people,(he wanted to get elected, they all do that) that he will not have the power to keep. I have great concern for this country when the head of it, feels it is just fine to murder the unborn if you choose to do so, and feels that marriage should be for anyone but a woman and a man.( when you start messing with God's laws, you're in for it. Where does it end? I have my rights, and as a citizen of this country, I want to marry my brother cause I'm in love with him. Who's to say I can't?) I have a problem with a president who lies to get what he desires. I have a problem with health ins. for all. (who's going to pay for it?) God said if you don't work, then you don't get to eat. Period! Why should I have to pay for someone elses health care? If he decides to take away our right to bear arms, only the criminals and the government will have them. Look out! I'm not saying that Obama is not a nice man. He's probably very nice, but He is against most of the things that our God in Heaven stands for and when you go the route of the world and ignore God's ways, you will fail.

I haven't read any HATRED here. And I think the only one freaking out is you. We don't fear Obama, we just don't like his plan or his dishonest character. He lied far too many time during his campaign.(see the thread entitled 'why are you voting for Obama?' the 1st page. You'll see the long list of his proven lies)

I wasn't talking about taking your mom's advice on racism. (for I know that alot of the older generation still have issues with it) I was speaking on being more open to your mom's views about christianity.

For jodi and readystady go: maybe you should try to be more open to what your moms have to say. They are smarter, (like you said) older, and wiser and have the truth.

You certainly put alot of words in my mouth once again that I didn't say! I NEVER predicted the end of the world.(only that every day that passes is one day closer to the end, and that things in this world will only get worse as each day passes.(and this is not MY prediction, but what God says) WOW! Did I call OBama the Antichrist???? I am very happy for the celebration of getting over the race hurdle, and am happy that this country can have a president of any race. But like I said before, choosing the next president should not be based on the color of a persons skin, but on charater, integrity, honesty, experience,etc. I believe that if McCain were a black candidate, he would have been the winner. The people have been waiting for a time such as this, and alot of them voted based on his skin color. My own daughter admits to that. She's 21 years old, black and white, and says she wanted a black president. Some of my coworkers that are black told me the same thing. This is one thing I don't understand. People of color want racism to end, yet they segregate themselves at times. Like setting up organizations like 'The Negro collge fund' or 'BET (black entertainment Television) or even in Lap band talk with the 'WOC' (women of color) thread. If white people Had a 'WPO' (white people only) thread here, they would be jumped all over. It would be called racism. They defend their title (WOC) by saying "white is a color." If white is a color, then why have a WOC thread?, just post on any of the other threads out there. I can only hope that the issue of racism in this country will now end with this election. But I fear that all the other (and to me the more important) issues will be affected negatively, and that's a shame, because the country put getting over the hurdle of racism ahead of what's right. Instead of voting for the candidate with the better moral character, they chose the candidate whose skin was darker. Oh, they'll never admit that it was for that reason, but as you can see how they are celebrating the victory on the race issue in the news today, you know it WAS for that reason.

When I view all of the celebration over Obamas win, I see all of the happiness over a first in this country. While this is a wonderful thing to be happy about (Our first African American President) it is not a celebration for me. The color of a persons skin was not my reason for voting for a president. I wish mcCain were an African American, then he would have won. I certainly can understand why all people of color would want to see the day when the president of the United States were a black man. This is a great historical moment. But, climbing over all the racial hurdles in this country was not a good enough reason to vote for an inexperienced man who seems to me to be dishonest, who wants to spread the wealth around, who doesn't have a care for the unborn children, and whom I believe wouldn't ask God for guidance every morning before he begins his work day. God help our country. The bible tells us that in the end times, it doesn't get better, it only gets worse. So, I see this as a sign that we are only closer to the return of Jesus. America gets the leadership it chooses. Now we wait and see.

Civil unions are not marriages. Marriage is: An institution ordained of God for the exchanging of vows and promises between a man and a woman who make this commitment before Him. Since 2 people of the same sex couldn't possibly be saying their vows before God, it is then a civil union. I say that they couldn't possibly be saying their vows before God for 2 reasons. #1) God does not approve of homosexual marriage.(This can be proven by reading the scripture). YOU (and anyone else who wants to) can approve of it if you like. He gives everyone free will to either follow his ways or go their own way. ( but just remember, He also establishes consequences for every action we take, whether right or wrong) and #2.)If you are gay, you don't have a belief in God, therefore why say vows before Him. If you believed in God, you would also believe what he tells you about the sin of homosexuality, (mainly that it is wrong). If you want to sleep with the same gender, it wouldn't affect me. You're right, the sky wouldn't fall in. Do whatever you wish, just don't call it a marriage or try to change the laws in this country to call it a marriage. Make up your own 'title' for what you want to call it. I thought 'civil union' was ok. Why not keep that? Also, just because there are many gay people that exist doesn't mean it is part of God's plan.(as you say) Because it is not His plan, any more than it is His plan for someone to be gluttonous, or alcoholic, or to kill unborn babies, or to lie....(the list of the sins in this world can go on and on) But I'm sure you get my point. My last response to your post is this: I do not use God as an excuse to indulge myself in making judgements on anyone. God alone is the Judge of this world, and He stated very boldly in his book that "There is only one Lawgiver and Judge; the one that is able to save and destroy."(James 4:12) That being said, I choose to go along with what HE says is acceptable or not. I judge noone.

You don't have to fear me; I wont hurt you. But, seeing the quote of mine that you chose to comment on, I can see that You have an issue with what GOD has to say on some campaign issues, so it is HIM that you need to fear, not me. I only go along with Him on what he has to say is right or wrong. I dont make the rules, I just try to live by them and point thewm out to others so that they will have their eyes opened as well.

I never told my nephew that the way he was born was bad. Wow, you put alot of words in my mouth. And, It's not what I think, it's what GOD thinks. I only go along with Him, He makes the rules. He's God. He can do that. If He says that having sex with the same sex is wrong, Then it is! To me, there is no debate, because I believe in Him. To you, there is a debate because you either don't have a belief in God, or if you do, you choose to pick and choose His laws to follow. ( Whatever is right in YOUR eyes you will adhere to.) We will all answer to Him one day for the deeds done in the flesh.

She tells me she decided to be gay when she met her girlfriend and fell in love with her. ( After all, she was married to a man for many years and loved him.) Her son on the other hand says he was born gay. Either way, you only sin if you act on it.

Being gay is not the same as being overweight, except that they are both sinful. Like I said, God loves the sinner and hates the sin. Both my sister and her son do not feel that I am their enemy. They love me as much as I love them. My sister was married to her husband for 26 years and had 2 sons together. One of them is gay. When they got divorced, she started seeing a woman and is still with her. That is her choice. She knows that I side with God and what He says on the issue of homosexuality. I do believe though, that every human being CAN decide who they will or will not have sex with. If you have 'feelings' for the same sex, it is your choice to be obedient to God and refrain from that act or to do as you choose to do.