pattygreen

Miss California, Carrie Prejean, was runner up for the Miss USA Pageant. She answered a question about gay marriages, and gave her opinion on what she feels about homosexuals being allowed to get married. She said that she feels they should not be married. She was told by her state sponsors that she needed to apologize to the gay community. They also told her to not talk about her beliefs. She refused to do so. Since when, in this country, can't you speak your opinion, without being bashed for it? The homosexual community has no problem telling others how they feel about it. I don't agree with them, but I'm not asking for an apology from anyone who's gay. I applaud her for standing up for what she felt was the right answer and not backing down on her beliefs when the question was posed. She was representing the majority of the people in California when she gave her answer, after all. I believe that if you are homosexual and you want to live that life style, it's your life, so go ahead. But I also believe that God instituted the marriage union between a man and a woman together. They say their vows to Him. So, to call the homosexual lifestyle a 'marriage' is a wrong term for it. It's not a marriage. Why can't they call it a civil union, or anything else they like. Like maybe "Partnership" or how about "a love unit". Whatever. The term 'marriage' is already taken. They can still have all the same rights as married couples do. Why aren't they satisfied with that? Do they just like to argue?

We don't need to legalize ANY sinful activity. We already have enough of that. Abortions are legal, smoking and drinking is legal,(now the talk is legalizing marajuana) homosexual marriages are becoming legal state by state, (now there is talk of the "threesome marriage") Oh brother! What next? Siblings getting married? How about legalizing drug use? It's one thing to allow the people of the land to make their own choices in their own lives, it's quite another thing to legalize them. You want to sleep with some one of the same sex? go ahead. You want to sell your body for sex, go ahead. This is America, you can do anything you want. But to make it the law of the land is where I have to object. There are some issues in this world that are gray areas when it comes to sin. There are others that are black and white and there is no room for compromise.

People who prostitute themselves don't need a help with their sin like gluttons or drug addicts or alcoholics do. They just need to change jobs. Like I said already my problem is not with those who CAN'T help themselves, like drug addicts or abused victims or the mentally retarded. It's with those who CAN help what they do. Like PROSTITUTES. If they are USED to making 700. a week and can't afford to live on a Mcdonalds paycheck of 325.(my son works there and makes that much, full time take home pay)then they need to down size. Get rid of cable and cell phones and any other unnecessary bills they have , move into a cheaper rent, stop buying expensive clothes and do some tag saling, whatever it takes to stop living that way. People in this country live on less than that and don't have to resort to prostitution to get by.

I know that wasa has me on ignore, but I'm responding to this anyway. WHO said that those who are addicted to drugs should be hung and judged?! NOT me. Go back and reread my posts. I believe that addicted people need to be helped. But the help they need is REHAB. As for my own sin of gluttony, I have said this before and I'll say it again. I am a sinner. Just like everyone else on this board. I don't deny my sins, or claim they are diseases, or say I was born that way. I ADMIT them and CONFESS them and God has forgiven me for them just like he'll forgive anyone else for theirs.

It's wonderful to help those that are down, like you say. The mentally ill, the jobless, those who are addicted to drugs, etc. It's just not wonderful to enable the prostitutes she deals with daily to CONTINUE to live in their sin by helping them. If they were denied care UNLESS they stopped their sinful lifestyle, they just might turn from it.

First of all, drug abuse is an ADDICTION and prostitution is NOT. Prostitution is a CHOICE that he or she CHOOSES. Drug abusers can't help their 'need' for their drug. Even so, they shouldn't get the publics help in any way unless they are willing to enter rehab FIRST. Yor example of lacing their drugs is NOT my way. I don't condone killing people. I just don't condone enabling anyone. If your friends condone the example you gave, then you need to get new friends. So, let me get this straight. You feel that it's okay to give funds and donations of food to your local food pantry to help those who can't afford food for their families and then have those who really don't need that food (because they CHOOSE to buy cigarettes, which could kill you BTW, or use their money on fancy clothes, you know, 'other' things they'd rather have) be the recipients of your charity which was intended to help the poor? WOW, go figure? You are absolutely right when you say that if a person chooses behavior that is a sin or detremental to their health, that it is their choice. I'm all for choices. Just don't expect the rest of us to have to shell anything out to you because you want to CONTINUE in that sin. Why should I have to pay for a prostitutes medical care when she gets aids or an STD? She knew the risks? Just what are you talking about when you say I'm inflicting punishment? That's a new one. I can understand when you say I'm passing judgement, cause you don't know what that means, but inflicting punishment? Judgement: a final sentence. I've NEVER given anyone a final sentence on anything. I don't have the authority to do that. Only God does. I can only point out what God calls sinful. Oh, and BTW I never said anywhere that I was an instrument of God. I believe that God will use anyone he chooses to tell others about what he says is right and wrong in life. Your insults don't offend me.

I'm not talking about mentally ill people or those involved in domestic violence or even the average Joe who works at McDonalds or Nadia Sulemon. I'm refering to PROSTITUTES who are living a sinful lifestyle. Anyone who is living in sin and refuses to turn from their ways should not be given a handout. How you turn what I said around! I'm all for helping the menatlly handicapped who can't help themselves and for others who by no choice of their own are down on their luck. I just don't feel that prostitutes should get any help unless they turn from what they are doing. FYI, I don't support anyone who does wrong, whether they are a christian or not, and I never said I supported N.Sulemon's choices.

gadgetlady, thank you for posting that link. I found it very interesting.

my example above about my tenant smoking and "choosing" to buy cigarettes over food, and then going to the food bank for her food is a perfect example of this. If she quit smoking and then bought food with her money instead, and there still wasn't enough food to feed herself, no one would care if she went to the food bank to get some then. When you are doing what's 'right' in life, you deserve help and charity from others, when your not, you don't. The bible and the 10 ommandments have been this Nations guidebook since the beginning, andlike Patrick Henry remarked "It can not be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religions,but by Christians; not on religions, but on the gospel of Jesus Christ." And George Washington said "It is impossible to govern rightly without God and the bible." You need to have 'something' to go back on, because who's to determine what is 'right' and what is 'wrong' for the people. One person says "this is right for me." The other says "this is wrong". Let's use God's word to determine it. After all, he's the one who created us.

Nadia Sulemon made a mistake when she decided to have more children without a father or the means to support them. I have ALWAYS said that. NOW that its been made, there is nothing she can do about it, her kids need to be supported. A prostitute CONTINUES in her sin. She CONTINUES to have sex outside of marriage as a means to get money and if she stopped doing that and then was TRYING to better herself by working at an 'honorable' decent profession, she could then seek public assistance and no one should balk. How is one so right and the other so wrong? Neither is right. But the difference is the "continuing' of the sin. Nadia made a stupid choice, but isn't choosing to repeat it and prostitutes have made a stupid choice and DO choose to repeat it. Relying on public health care is just a 'consequence' of their sin for them and the rest of society. IF they did what was right and had a regular job and wasn't committing fornication with their bodies, they might not be needing public assistance. And if anyone is needing public assistance, but isn't sinning, but is just having a difficult time financially, no one is going to begrudge them help.(like the girl at McDonalds who gets pregnant for example) I don't feel that prostitution should be illegal because they often rely on public assistance, as you say. I believe it should be illegal because it's a SIN. It is WRONG to have sex with anyone that isn't your spouse. Period. And then to do it to make money is even sicker IMO.

You don't know me at all, so please don't feel sorry for me. I don't hate anyone, I just hate their bad choices. It's funny how whenever someone points out that the reason people get into the lifestyles or predicaments they're in is due to their own wrong doing, others like you, try to pin it on "hate". What's wrong with telling someone , like a prostitute for instance, that if she would put on a nice outfit and comb her hair and go to her local Walmart and apply, she has a chance at getting a job there? If she's drug addicted, she needs to go to a rehab and get help. If she refuses to go, then she reaps the consequences of that. How about if everyone stopped enabling people with these kinds of problems, then maybe they would just have to do something about it themselves. I'm glad you love your job, but what does that have to do with anything I said? I think it's wonderful that you help people out. If women choose to have sex with someone other than the one she is married to, for whatever reason, like to make money, then the consequences go along with that. All I'm saying is that you reap what you sow. If you do the 'right' things in life, you can usually avoid things like aids, STDs, unwanted pregnancies, etc. I had a tenant who would go to the local food bank every week, cause she had no money for food, but she had a 2 pack a day addiction to cigarettes. If I was running that food bank, I'd tell her she couldn't receive any food because if she would quit smoking, she would easily be able to afford her own groceries. It's not right to enable people, because when you do, you keep them bound to their sin. In order for them to DO something about their circumstance, they need to hit the bottom sometimes, so they can bounce back. It's called 'tough love'. It's not about 'hating' anyone.

And they can do that so long as they don't expect the tax payer to pay for their consequences that come along with their wrong doing. When it is expected that the rest of society has to bare the burden of their sin, then the laws should be that it is illegal. Prostitutes usually work under the table (not all) and they don't have an employer giving them health benefits.

I don't know if IVF is okay with God or not. You are killing a fertilized egg when you toss out the ones you don't use, so I believe that it is wrong if you do that.If you are donating them or use them later, I don't know. On the other hand, I don't know how he feels about married women using another mans sperm to get herself pregnant. These are not spoken of in scripture. I guess God would want us to use our knowledge that we have of life beginning at conception to make a call on it. I feel that throwing away unused fertilized eggs is equal to abortion. This is why I am also against some stem cell research that destroys the fetus.

My theory on that is this: If there were no consequences for our wrong choices in life, we would all continue in a spiral downward. When prostitutes continue in their profession, even though no one likes it, they must deal with their own consequences, whether it be STD's, death, or brutality. They ALL know the risks involved in what they do. Just about anybody can hold a decent job. No excuses!

It is hard for us to understand, but I will try to answer what I believe and from what I've learned about God. God is the author of all life. He is the potter and we are the clay. He has the right to decide which souls he will have live on earth and which souls he will have live in Heaven with him. All babies and children are saved and go directly to God when they die. It isn't until a child or young adult is old enough to understand and reason within himself that there is a God, that he becomes accountable for the destiny of his own soul. Before that time, if he dies, he enters Heaven. With God, there is no 'time' like there is with humans. With God, all things are eternal. He doesn't see life coming to an end as we do, for all he sees is a change of destination. When he allowed your baby to enter into heaven, he saw it as a wonderful blessing for your baby, even though he knows that sometimes we humans don't understand that. We grieve at the loss of those we love, so for us death is traumatic. But for God, death is just a doorway into his home for all those he created. The difference between God making that choice for a life and us making that choice by abortion is that God has the right to make it, and we don't. He has a plan for every soul individually. A baby that has physical problems when born brings 'something' to this world. Whether it be joy for his parents, tollerence for those who lack compassion or patience for those who may be close to him or her. We are all needed, whether free from illness and physical problems or not free from them. Again, I am sorry for your loss, but if it's any consolation, any at all, your baby is in God's presence and to be there is a beautiful thing. My love to you. Patty

I just watched the movie 'Taken'. What a story! Liam Neeson Played a father whose daughter was abducted and put into prostitution. It revolved around his quest to find her. Watch that movie and see if you feel that it should be legalized. Forced, into the profession, or not, it's definitely immoral.

rodriguezequal. So sorry to learn of the loss of your baby. I will pray that God will give you peace about it. My heart goes out to you. sincerely, patty

I don't know for certain, all I can do is see the fruits of her life, the deeds of her life, her sisters actions, her mothers comments about raising them, the dysfunction in the whole families lives. When they were young, her mother allowed them to dress as if they were in their 20's. Her older sister was allowed to dance using alluring and provocative moves at a very young age, their apparel tells me they are looking for attention, etc. All I can do is come to my own assertation that they grew up in a screwed up home. My opinion.

School should be for academics ONLY. If it were, maybe more parents would do their job and teach their kids about sex and cooking and auto repair and so on. If they knew they wouldn't be getting anything but math, english, science and social studies there, then they wouldn't ignore their job at home. And if they did anyway, then when their kids grew up and didn't know how to cook for themselves, they'd have to go out and eat, and if they didn't know how to repair a car then they'd have to take it to a garage, and if they didn't know how to put on a condom, they'd use trial and error. So what! That's the whole reason why I homeschool my kids. The public school has infiltrated academic education with all kinds of crap that's not in their place to provide. Heck, our public high school had a fortuneteller and a hypnotist entertain them one year. I'm so against that stuff in schools.

I, too, would not condone the mistreatment of any group of people. Nor would I poke fun at anyone. I also wholeheartedly believe in stating an honest, (real, as you call it) answer to why I don't agree with same sex marriages while respecting all people. If I were miss California, I would have answered in the same way and never have regretted it. Marriage is for 2 people only and they are 1 woman and 1 man.

I don't believe that there is a deep seated dislike for gays in general as you say. I know that's not it in my case and I'm sure others feel the same way. It is a deep seated dislike for their action of having sex with the same sex. My son smokes cigarettes, and I hate that. I LOVE my son dearly, I dislike his smoking habit. The negative talk is our 'objection' of the sin. A catholic Bishop said this, and I agree with him: "We don't see same sex marriage as a civil rights issue because there's never a right to do something that's morally wrong." If others want to call those opposed to same sex marriage 'intollerant', then so be it. We that are opposed know that we are not intollerant of people, but of their wrong doings. I said in an earlier post my reasons for why same sex marriage shouldn't become law. Mainly that it is one thing to be free to do the things that you want in the privacy of your own home, sinful or not, but that it is quite another thing to make it lawful. I saw on TV yesterday that there are those who are now desiring marriage for a threesome. See what I mean? Where will it end? Can we have marriage between siblings? How about If I loved my pet enough to marry it? It's my 'right'.

Wouldn't you think that since the book of Revelations is a prophetic book, that when God was giving it to John to write, through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, that God knew the writings would be contained in 'one' book that would be put together? The Bible. And that his writings would be placed at the end of that book. Also, when John was writing his letters, he would not have called them a 'book'. They were simply letters he was writing. They became a 'book' after they were put together to form the bible. Would you agree?

I don't believe anyone would be against any of that teaching. But, that's being done now, and how's it working? Abortion is on the rise. How about teaching girls that if they want to be loved and to have affection from a boy. Never give in sexually. If every girl held back until marriage, these boys would know that sex wasn't an option. They would find a girl that they were fond of, fall in love and then commit. This is the way it was not less than 100 years ago. But society has moved soooo far from what's right in God's eyes that they are now reaping what they have sown. Abortions, unwanted pregnancies, STDs, and the like. If you want these things to end, then we have to turn from our ways. Starting with each person individually. Telling the kids about God and his laws that he made for our own good.

I believe it is better to spend all our money on protecting us from future terrorists than to spend it on unnecessary crap!

(see my comments above) The arguement is the turn from what's right in God's eye's to what's not right. The more the people choose to push God out of this great country, the less he will be involved. The same way we don't want our country to legalize abortions because it is a sin is the same way we don't want gay marriages to be legalized. Because it is a sin. We also wouldn't want stealing to be legalized because it is a sin. If we could keep smoking cigarettes from the people, we would. That's a sin, too. What's wrong with not wanting those things that are sinful from being allowed? You think people would be happy to keep unrighteousness from the land. It's onething to go ahead and live any way you choose, sinful or not, it's quite another thing to make it a law that the Nation adheres to. If people want to sin, this country gives them that freedom to do so, and so does God for that matter, but once the country bands together and formally makes it okay with their laws and statutes, God sees that the people have made their choice. They choose sin over him. He then removes his blessings from us. Is that what you want?