ELENATION

I'm what you call a "church goer" even though I think there are more pleasant words when refering to a religious person.... If my religion would put me in that situation, I guarantee you 100% that I would stop being part of such religion. Just because someone is religious or a "church goer" doesn't mean that I check my brains at the door of the church, we "church goers" and actually every single person in this world should be competetent enough to not let a child that is under our care die under ANY circumstances when it can be avoided, religious or not, if someone is not competent enough, smart enough, mentally stable enough, or is a fanatic irrational religious person, then that person must not have custody of a child, period. In my opinion, it's that simple, and I speak from a believer;s stand point, I believe in the power of prayer myself, but I also believe that laws should be implemented to prevent people from making fatal decisions like this one with a child. We can believe in the power of prayer as much as we want, believing is our right, but we also must give our children the medical care when they need it , I believe that when we exercise our right to practice religion in a way that leads to somone's death it's about time to give up the right and for the government to intervene, since unfortunately there are plenty of religious and non-religious people out there who have absolutely no common sense and are irresponsible, some are just pure evil and hide behind religion to commit crimes as well, there are all kinds out there, so someone must protect the children who legally can't protect themselves, and if that means that some parents/guardians need to be told that prayers are not enough to save their children's lives in order to comply with the law, then that is what needs to be done, I'm all for freedom of religion, gee specially that I'm religious myself, but I'm also all for protecting the life of a child and for setting our priorities straight as well.

Agree with you on this one, don't like to watch David C....ewk! and David A. gives me the willies..... I don't like to watch him either, I rather listen to both, good voices.... my favorite is Michael Johns..... He is cute hottie and I love his voice! I want him to win....:bolt: I'm glad that Ram is gone and I agree that Christy needs to go already for Pete's sake... I love Dolly, and I don't like country either, but she is too funny! ok, let the best win.... but I don't know if that ever happens....

Green, thank you for the update, I've been thinking about you, I'm glad that you are happy with the doctors and that in that part things are going well, that's a relief...hanging in there, you will beat this! and keep us updated. Elena

Thank you for this information, unreal how some people can be such a$$holes.... that witch! I'm glad you stood up for yourself, reading this e-mail made me mad just thinking how some people behave so inhumane.. I agree with what you said previously as well, it's extremely nice to see how all differences are put aside for Green! that is a very good thing. Elena

Hi Gadget, I was off for a few days and when I checked this thread again I wanted to respond , add more, comment, it's so frustrating...but frankly you have done such a great job, you put my own feelings and thoughts in such a clear manner when you write that I decided not to add anything else, you nailed it every time and I thank you for that, you are the greatest advocate for those tiny unborn babies that can't speak for themselves and for that I admire you.:biggrin:

Yes, I personally would, jehovas witness or anybody that lets a child that is under their care die for any reason, I don't care what the reason may be, religious or not, it's still negligence that caused death. As I see it, it's black or white, no gray areas for me on this one...

I totally agree with you Laurend, the government should definitely intervene when a child is being neglected, and I don't care if the reasons are religious or not, it shouldn't matter, the only thing that should matter is the life of that child, gee.... And if they want to use holistic medicine first, that's fine, but if the child doesn't respond to it, the parents should be forced to use modern medicine as well, we are talking about saving a life of a minor who can't choose for herself, should the government allow this child to die in order to respect freedom of religion? heck no! in my opinion, the line must be drawn right there.

Everything you have said in this post is what I meant to say in my previous post, but I'm not so eloquent, but I completely agree and you stated it so very well and clear, thank you. Elena

OMG! to freaking funny! seriously this thread is therapy....:huh2: BUt you know, men don't care, they do it no problem! The only thing I can do in front of him is # 1..... and that is if it's an emergency... but I don't enjoy it either... DH has told me that I passed gas while sleeping, but I tell him he is lying and tell him off... so he leaves me alone... I really hope he is lying.... Now, and listen Wheestin because you are a mommy to be.... when I was having my first daughter, and I was in labor was pushing.... the nurse left me alone in the room with DH to keep pushing every time I got a contraction... I wasn't quiet ready yet, so they were getting me there... well, on one of those pushes, there came the poop out! I thought I was going to die, I was embarrassed that the nurse will come right back and would find that I just pooped and I was so embarrassed that DH saw it too, and of course I had labor pains at the same time, not a pretty picture.... DH stayed there not knowing what to do or say, I asked him to clean me immediately! he came with a little tissue paper in his hand... and I told him to better go get the whole darn box, he did and he cleaned me up.... nothing was said at that moment, but later at home, he started teasing me about me pooping and him having to clean my butt and he still does to this day.... and I still get pissed at him... and not even after that traumatic experience I can bring myself to do # 2 in front of him.... With my second daughter, I specifically asked for an enema when I got to the hospital.... so I was empty when I had to push and thankfully, no accidents this time!:ohmy:

THat is too funny!!!!!!!! LOL! that poor man probably thought that you were going nuts!:lightbulb: But I would also go to any extreme to avoid doing it in front of him..... at least you have become more laid back about it, but not me... I just can't....:ohmy: after so long, maybe I have gas issues....:bathbaby:

OMG! it can't be that bad!:ohmy: that's terrible! how is the stinking gas related to the surgery? I wonder if there is way to avoid them... believe it or not, I've been married 17 years and I have never passed gas in front of hubby, or done # 2.... unless I passed gas while sleeping....but I hope not...I know, maybe I'm too extreme, but I'm very shy when it comes to those things.... now imagine if I was passing those killer bombs.... so embarrasing...

HOW COME NOBODY TOLD ME THIS BEFORE? I WENT THROUGH THE WHOLE SURGERY ROUTINE....:thumbup:

Kat, congratulations on beating the cancer! you were also so strong....:thumbup:

Oh Green, a big, huge HUG (((((((((((((((((((((((()))))))))))))))))))))))) I'm sorry that you have to go through all this, you do have a happy and strong spirit, I've always seen that in you and that will help you tremendously. My grandfather had throat cancer, and this was many years ago, well, I was 8 years old and I'm 45 now... science was not so advanced yet, and still, he went through his radiation and he went in remission for years, actually when he passed away, it had nothing to do with the cancer, I still remember my mom going with him to the hospital for his radiation....so now a days , there are so many options and great treatments that I'm confident that you are going to be just fine, I know how you feel though, and it can be scary , but please, hang in there, you can beat this! stay strong Green! we are here for you, pulling for you all the way, you have great home support, you can do this! I know it! Enjoy the chocolate ice cream...yummy! and keep those curves! Please feel the love!!!!!!!!!!!!!:thumbup:

You know, you are so right! I'm not big on the green enviroment, but I'm BIG on our GREEN! and I can definitely support her on this one! and on anything else I can! Elena:thumbup:

It is very heartfelt what you wrote, and I definitely understand where you are coming from, I haven't seen that suffering in person, but on TV, or I have read it and it is still very painful, so I can imagine how you feel when you see it with your own eyes and right in front of you ...I know that we want to just stop the suffering, deciding to be pro-life or pro-choice is not a light decision, I feel like sadly sometimes nobody wins, certainly in cases of rape, incest it's heart wrenching... when the parents just don't plan the pregnancy and behave irresponsibly, then they should be held accountable... so many different scenarios... I understand... As a pro-life I don't think I have the answer or the solution to the social problem ... I, like you would like to just end the horrible suffering, but like Gadget said, killing the unborn baby is not the answer either... I just wish that there was a better solution, and we must keep working hard to find it, meanwhile, someone will stand defending the mother's choice but someone must stand defending the baby's life.... I have much respect for the work you do, just wanted to add that. Elena

GEE, I AGREE, WOULD YOU ALL STOP COMPLAINING! HERE I AM UNFILLED, BECAUSE MY ESOPHAGUS GOT DILATED AND I HAD REALLY BAD ACID REFLUX, HA! MY BAND WAS TOO TIGHT, WHO WOULD'VE THOUGHT....? IT'S BEEN A WHILE NOW, I HAVE GAINED SOME WEIGHT BACK, CRAP! AND BTW, WHEN I GOT THAT LAST UNFILL, THEY POKED ME ENOUGH TIMES TOO...AND IT FREAKING HURT! NOW, DO I NEED TO HEAR EVERYBODY'S COMPLAINTS? WELL, THAT'S NOT FAIR... YOU ALL GET WITH THE PROGRAM AND POST ONLY HAPPY EXPERIENCES PLEASE... THE NERVE....:thumbup:

Green, I'm so sorry about the diagnosis, please know that my thoughts are with you, my best wishes that you will go through this strong and that you will be just fine Green, I'm praying too , (((((((((((((((()))))))))))))))))) Elena

Yes, I agree, I personally didn't know enough about development of the unborn baby when I was younger and specially if you feel in distress at one particular time, it's even easier to make a wrong decision or uninformed decision...

I don't find it surprising either, as long as the abortion clinics are legal and running, maybe it should mandatory that they must show an ultrasound to the mother and they must sign a document that they saw it entirely, not that this will solve the problem, but at least it will provide additional information for the mother to make the decision...

I think that once you have seen it with your own eyes, you can understand why someone would change her mind... if you look at anybody's ultrasound it's still very significant, but when you look at your own, it is truly life altering in my opinion, then again, maybe I'm thinking that everyone feels like me? I don't know anymore...

Yes, and I believe it and I've experienced it....I remember when my pregnancy test showed positive and it was great and I was so happy, when I saw my first ultrasound, it added a sense of responsability, a love for that human being growing inside me, it was life altering... so I can definitely believe that seeing the development of the unborn baby is very powerful.

THat is exactly right, and perfect example... I most definitely feel much compassion for women who were in a crisis and didn't know better, but after you see it in front of you and you know it in your heart, well... I'm not going to judge, but I would hold that person responsible.

Yeah, we must be informed even when it hurts, sometimes I watch programs showing what St Jude Hospital does and I promise you that I sit there and cry , cry so hard when I see those children sick and suffering, but at the same time, it made me pick up the phone and make my monthly donation, same when I've watched "save the children" it's so hard to watch and I want to change the channel, but if I watch it long enough, I just can't help but to do something about it, even if it's just a little donation, but I feel like if I ignore it, I'm just giving up on it.... same with the abortion, when I watched those videos, if I was convinced that it was wrong before, after watching them, I just couldn't even imagine the idea of considering abortion, or supporting the idea, even if some believe that it's a woman's right, when you actually watch it, you can see in front of your eyes that it's murder...I know that sounds dramatic, but really, it's not, what happens to the unborn baby is just horrible and if I was to say that I don't support abortion, but I support the right to anybody have an abortion, to me it's like saying I don't support murder, but I support the right for people to kill if they want to... I just can't do it...

This is Giorgio, my kitty, he is a big white fur ball as you can see... spoiled... smart, funny and so loving... I love dogs too, and I'm planning to get one soon... I love all the pets that have been posted....too darn cute...