ELENATION

Neither am I really , I feel it in my heart and the thoughts are in my head, but I can't find the right words to explain the difference....

LOL! I'm sending love waves your way.......!

You know...I understand you...I think it's a toughy.... because I like my faith, and I don't "have" to have proof....but it would be nice to have both in my case... even though certain events in my life have been so real that I could claim them as proof.... but I don't want to bore anyone with that....plus they are too personal.... but I think I could say that... I recognize that it's not easy to live by faith alone...

Got you...I think that belief is a choice, faith...not...

Yes, I agree that if you have evidence you don't need faith, but in my personal life I enjoying living by faith at least in some areas of my life... I like it, I also find it humbling and that has helped me grow as a human being ... it's weird, because when I hear people saying that a lot of Christians are intolerant and even mean....in my case, I was more intolerant when I lived by evidence, I really didn't humbly myself before, and I wanted to have evidence every time, now, I'm more understanding of people, their lives, their suffering, their misfortunes, I think I'm kinder now, so it has worked for me.... also it helps that I'm not a scientist....hehe because I don't confront those issues all the time and I'm glad I don't because I feel better about myself the way I am now.... but I understand that it doesn't work the same for everyone....and now I'm going to use a word that Wassa tought me yesterday....I'm no "fundie" LOL!

I agree on this one...

Definitely, I see it... and I do see the possibility of scientific issues being involved, I'm not convinced though, and I don't have that much faith in it either, I have more faith in God... so it all comes down to what some believe and what others don't, etc... like you said.....

well, I understand that...but like you said, according to "some"........ I'd like to believe that most Christians are not pretending to have faith...what would be the point? hey, I'm sure there are some out there, but a Christian should know that GOd knows your heart and pretending would be lying to yourself..., I mean what is there to gain to pretend that one has faith then? to appear as a "nice" person in front of the world? maybe because someone may think that if people think that I'm a believer I may be a better person? I guess some people may do that, I personally think it's silly....again, it's like lying to myself....... I'd also like to think that I don't take "pride" in having faith, I talk about it here in rants because I enjoy the debates, they are darn interesting, I may talk about it with a fellow Christian, but I don't go around thinking or acting as very proud of having faith... I just happen to have faith, I don't know exactly why I have it....and I didn't always have it.... so it's not a matter of pride at least for me....

OH YEAH!!!!!!!! I was falling off my chair yesterday and laughing out loud reading his presidential post..... I was at work and people were asking me if I was ok.....oh man, he's got a way with words , he needs to become a writter...unless he is already one...? Love it!

I agree with you 100% with everything....and it takes a lot more faith for me to believe that the earth created itself.....most definitely. I loved your response/post.... very informational, just great. thank you.

Well, I have to disagree with you not being funny, and I urge everyone that may think Derrick is not funny to read the Presidential Candidates post on Rants.... it doesn't matter if you agree or not is plain and simple hilarious!!!!!!!

Well, in my opinion, you can't choose to believe because you need proof and I can choose because I don't need or care for proof, but I still feel it's a choice based on your own life experiences...at least in my case...

Gotcha.........!

COme on now Wassa, the water heater example was lame....LOL! You have a point because I couldn't choose to stop believing right at this moment, because my heart tells me not to, however, based on a life changing event, I could choose to stop, yes my choice would be affected by that event, but it's still a choice...and what I'm thinking is that I have two friends that are doctors, they know a lot more scientific facts that I do, I'm not terribly studious...I do read a lot, but not scientific important stuff all the time, I do have my moments though...haha... and when I've heard them express their faith even with all the facts that they have and that I've listened to from them, they both said that they still choose to believe.... and I do feel that same way.... but I admit that it's easy to be confuzzled..... ...and no corrections to my grammar now girl.... the word "workshiper" is still pounding in my head.....hehehe..

Please forgive me if I'm taking this statement in the wrong way, but when I read or hear things like "Don't get me wrong, I like Mormons. They aren't bad".......what are we really saying? because I like or dislike people for who they are as individuals, and not for the religion that they may be part of... so it's a very generic phrase for me.... I've heard similar statements when some people are talking about other people from different countries..."Oh I like Puerto Ricans, or Cubans, or whatever, they are not bad" shouldn't it be that you like that particular person for many other reasons, then why mention Mormons, or Christians or Europeans???? sorry, am I being anal..? don't mind me then.....LOL!

Yeah, it's got to do with the area for sure....Also I was thinking that the few I got were JW's...each time....so maybe it has to do with the denomination as well...

I had my mind set up on Rudy...I don't know anymore... i just LOVED, AND LAUGHED AND LOVED this post!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Elena

hhhhhhmmmmmmmm, if believing is not a choice, then what it is? I choose to believe in God due to my own reasons, experiences, research, and yes, feelings and heart, etc, but I do add my brain to the equation as well..right at this minute nothing will make me stop believing in God, and I don't anticipate it in my future, but if something life changing or some very relevant information was in front of me and I could see that I was wrong, I could choose to stop believing....I don't see why not... right now, there is just nothing conclusive for me to change though, however, I've had wonderful and meaningful spiritual experiences that makes my Christian faith stronger... .........but never a fundie...sp? LOL!

Totally agree, and also I've never tried to convert anybody, ever....

With that I totally agree and the site that you posted above is simply disgusting.... I'm sorry that you have encountered so many horrible Christians in your life..... I've encountered a few horrible atheists, and a few horrible Christians and a couple of horrible muslims.... not counting the terrorists around the world....because I hadn't dealt with them personally....LOL I also read that you have Christians at your door steps all the time trying to convert you and/or condemn you... I'm 45, in my entire life, I think they knocked on my door...say 2-3 times max....and now that I remember, it always happened at this particular house, so I gues I've been just lucky....maybe they work more in some areas? I don't know.... I'm trying to think if I would be very bothered if an atheist would show up at my door steps and tried to convert me....I'd like to think that I wouldn't be so bothered by it....I think I probably wouldn't care and I would probably be nice to them....now if it happened all the time....well, then maybe I'd be pissed.... mostly because I would have to be getting up and answering the dang door....lOL!

Even though I understand your point, from a Christian standpoint, I also encounter plenty of loud horrible atheists....in different forums, etc... but it's not always all of them, so I wouldn't say the "the nice" folks sit back and watch... because then I'd be saying that atheists in general are not nice....I'm sure you've encountered some loud horrible Christians, same way I've encountered some loud horrible atheists, but I'm sure that there are some from both groups sitting back and watching and being nice....

<p> </p> <p>The way I see is that whoever hates that way is wrong and cruel, it doesn't make any greater impression on me because a Christian or a Muslim or an Atheist said it... just because the Christians or the Muslims are supposed to abide by their rules or standards of their religion doesn't make them perfect and sometimes they may do wrong and sometimes big time wrong... like being hateful ......and just because an atheist doesn't have to live by some group's rules or standards or religion's rules doesn't make them any less accountable and the impression that either will leave for me is exactly the same...</p>

I respectfully disagree.... I don't think it's necessarily the loudest.... I do agree that is a minority though.... Also, I've heard people from different religions and also atheists speaking with hate in their hearts, I don't think it matters that one says that they believe in a higher power and the other one doesn't ,ultimately they are all wrong for speaking with hate, it's just not right... and I don't think that the religious one should be judged harsher because what their religion stands for and the atheists doesn't need to be judge so harsh because they don't really live by any standards, at least standards coming from a particular religion... so does that mean that atheists could get away with any type of behavior? , shouldn't atheists also live by at least some personal decent standards ? and isn't wrong to speak with hate, period? so IMHO , religious and atheists, they are both doing something wrong in a case like that...and if they are to be judged, which it's not my job for sure.... but if they are, then they should both be judged in the same way...

Thank you so much for your kind words...I totally agree with you, there are intolerant mean people in any religion or atheists, just in general..... you know, because some of the things that are writen in the Bible talk about condemnation, or because certain people that interpret the Bible in the wrong way, or like you said, because some few people that are behaving wrong and are Christians, it definitely doesn't mean that everyone is the same.... I also know many Christians and most of them are loving and caring and good people... not perfect, and they don't claim to be perfect either.... Love Elena

And I hear ya... what I do, like most believers , is believe by faith.... to me, it works....... and I'm convinced that there are things and beings that exist and we just can't prove it, not easily anyway... I have two friends that are doctors (scientists) and they are believers....in fact, I think they are stronger than me in their faith... I love to hear them expressing their faith, being that they are scientists, and so educated, they can do it so clearly and make their point so much better than I can... There have been events from the Bible that have been proven from what I've read in the past....then again, the writers may be lying..... I think that if you don't want to believe, you won't no matter what....