CrankyMagpie

Hey there, I'm also getting the surgery for autoimmune arthritis. It has better odds of clearing up my pain than any of the meds that are still available to me. If that works out--if the surgery brings my arthritis under control--then even self-pay, at ~$12k, it's a steal, compared to the price of arthritis meds (except methotrexate, that's fairly inexpensive... but also not sufficient to control the arthritis alone, and I'm allergic to a whole class of biologics). I'm a little over two weeks out from the surgery (Oct 3), and I am having all kinds of second and third and fourth thoughts. If I'm in the unlucky percentage of people whose arthritis isn't significantly improved by the surgery, I worry I will regret having it done. (Very few people regret it, but it does happen.) This is, of course, pretty silly; even if the surgery doesn't directly improve my arthritis, weighing less will make it more bearable. Plus, there's the reduced stress from not having to live as a fat person in a society that hates fat people. And I feel like I'm in this terrible cycle, right now, where I am too tired and too in pain to take proper care of myself -- to cook the healthy foods (standing that long in the kitchen? can't do it) and go to the gym (pain and exhaustion combine to be very demotivating) and keep my caffeine intake under control (I'm always tired) -- and the surgery and its associated weight loss really may be enough to break that cycle for me. So I get the reluctance. But I also think weight loss surgery should be prescribed for more of us with autoimmune arthritis, based on the promising results from the studies that have been done. (And insurance should cover it. Heaven knows I'll be saving them a fortune, getting this done.)

Lol, you and I are opposites in this regard! (But I have a sugar-free high-protein pumpkin custard recipe, and it's not bad.) Also, @GreenTealael, I ordered a bunch of sugar-free Torani syrups (including pumpkin spice!) directly from Torani, and I was so impressed with the packaging they used! It was really, really good. (Less impressive if there isn't cardboard recycling in your area, but we have it here, so it was great.) I mean, I don't want to pressure you. But if the need gets real enough... 😁 I'll be drinking a lot of hot tea. And baked apples aren't a bad choice if you don't go adding lots of sugar and butter.

At four weeks out, barring weird complications or anything, my surgeon clears folks to lift weights. I bet they'll clear you for the coasters, @MargoCL! And @Ivy Joel, they wouldn't have invited you along if they didn't think of you as part of the family already. You are definitely focusing a lot more on this "not a blood relative" thing than they are. As an anxious person, myself, I know it does zero good to be told "don't worry so much," so I won't do that to you. But just know, they want you there! So even if you do have to take things a little slow, or whatever--four months out, I kind of doubt you'll have to, but even if you do--that's OK. Families make allowances for each other. (Or, well, they should.) ❤️

Oh, hey! Some of these are tree nut-free! Cool!

I'm self-pay, but my surgeon has a 3-month program he makes everyone go through, with 4 nutritionist visits, 4 visits with his PA, at least one visit/assessment with his psychologist, and a bunch of pre-tests (blood, ekg, echocardiogram, upper endoscopy, pulmonary, and if you score high enough on a particular survey, also a sleep study), plus a group class and a second meeting with him, two weeks before surgery. He also wants everyone to lose 10% of their initial weight, but if you have compelling enough reasons, he can sometimes be convinced to set that requirement aside. I feel like a lot of what I know about post-op is from reading books (Colleen Cook's The Success Habits of Weight Loss Surgery Patients 3rd Edition and ... something put out by the American Diabetes Association; Googling, it looks like maybe it was 21 Things You Need to Know About Diabetes and Weight-Loss Surgery?), forums, blogs (I love Banana Tummy and hope she is still doing well!), medical websites, studies available on PubMed, and the handouts my team hasn't yet given me but I found on their website and Google. I have been reading compulsively, and I wonder how well prepared I would be if I hadn't been doing that, even with my surgeon's program. (I mean, I would still know not to gobble Cinnabons. This whole, like, "protein first" thing ... yeah, they made sure I got that.) I wouldn't mind a quiz! But there isn't one. Other than "don't gain weight before the surgery," I guess.

Thanks ❤️ I am just real, real tired of being judged, being a fat person in a society that hates fat people, I guess. I fight fat stigma where I can--though I mostly don't bother here on bariatric surgery boards, for obvious reasons. But it's exhausting, so I pick my battles. I often avoid behaviors that'll draw attention to myself, unless I'm ready for a fight. At six months, I should be down ~60% of my excess weight (on average, or so my surgeon's PA tells me), and I know from (distant past) experience that I'm super comfortable living in the world at that weight--I don't feel like I'm at risk of being judged all the time. So, I mean, it's an arbitrary date, nothing written in stone. I'm honestly pretty comfortable at 30 pounds above that weight, so it may not even be that long? I guess there's also the whole "hey, I will probably have built some good habits and also learned how my new stomach works" thing, right? I have this vague idea that maybe I'll be drawn to healthier menu items after six months of semi-scrupulous healthy eating--or at least that I'll have further strengthened my "choose the healthy thing" muscles. And also I don't ever want to throw up in a restaurant if it can be avoided. So I'll do all the error testing at home. 😁 Which might mean we get Indian delivered, as a test run, and/or we get take-out from the sushi place nearby. I'm not planning a life of hardship, I promise. 😉

I'm super glad that works for you (sincerely! that's great!), but it isn't an option for me, either right now or in the period immediately after surgery. It does the opposite of what I want, by calling more attention to how much I'm eating, not less. I may be bold enough to do that when I inhabit a thin body, but I definitely won't do it now. (This is my own hangup, and it's probably more of a thing for therapy than a thing we can problem solve on a discussion board. I'm all right with that, though I do really appreciate your sharing what works for you! My spouse and I are both cool with not going to restaurants for 6-8 months. And if we get pulled in by friends before then, I can probably get him on board with @MargoCL's approach, especially since we're into Indian food and sushi, which both lend themselves pretty well to sharing.)

Ash replied to my post (nicely). You replied to her reply to me: "That's exactly my rebuttal, it's to track trends." It looked like you were saying "My rebuttal to Cranky is exactly the same as yours is." It felt personal, especially after you implied I didn't know how to use my own scale. (Which, OK, I'll acknowledge I'm primed to experience men-explaining-technology-unnecessarily with a bit more frustration than the average person, because I know more about technology than most men I encounter, and most men explain it to me anyway--not saying I know more about Arias than you do, but there's no evidence I know less, either; yet, you explained it to me. That may have colored how I read your second post, but maybe not. After all, it didn't have anything marking it as a general comment--something like "that's exactly my rebuttal when the accuracy of the individual measurements comes up," for instance, or simply, "I agree; I use it for trends." "Rebuttal" is an arguing word, as I said before, and when using an arguing word on a text-only medium, some extra clarification is helpful.)

"Rebuttal" is a strong word, here. I made it clear that I believe tracking trends is useful, as long as you're consistent about your level of hydration before you step on the scale. My larger point was people often take the numbers given by these scales as if any one of the readings is a useful number (which it is not), and they often misunderstand what the scale is measuring and don't go for consistent measurements. Consistent measurements get you the trend, which is useful. Inconsistent measurements get you junk data. I'm not sure that needed rebutting? Are you reacting strongly because I got a piece-of-junk Aria (it happens; I've gotten piece-of-junk Fitbits, too) and wrote off the whole line, and that frustrates you? (I saw your other post, but didn't reply. Since I'm replying to this one, I'll point out: I followed the directions, left it in one place, and gave it plenty of chances to calibrate. It still never reached a point where it would provide a stable measurement.) I acknowledge that it's possible that my scale was an aberration, and Arias are mostly great. Is that what you want me to say?

Hey, @mamadownsizing! We're semi-surgery-date-buddies! (Since your time zone is so far ahead of ours, you're actually probably closer on surgery time to @Oct517 than to me. But still,) October 3rd! Hi-5! 👍

I hated my Aria. It bounced around a LOT. Just as an FYI: the body composition scales are not super accurate. Because of how they work (measuring impedance), what they measure has a lot more to do with how hydrated you are than with your actual body fat composition. You can "hack" the measurement a bit by always measuring first thing in the morning, when you're at your most dehydrated--it still won't be especially accurate, but it'll at least be inaccurate in a more consistent way, so that you can map trends over time. I have a plain old boring digital scale, and I love it; it's fast and consistent between measurements. (Stepping off the Aria and back on it would get me a different number. Not so with my cheapo scale.) I like the color, which is a nice bonus. I really don't need it to connect to wifi. But I also love gadgets and support you all in getting your gadget on. 👍 Scales won't be my gadget of choice, but I'm sure I'll pick up other things. (Activity tracker-wise, I'm a Misfit fan.)

I've already warned my spouse: I'm probably not going to want to go out to eat for at least 6 months, maybe longer. Eating such small amounts, while in a visibly fat body... yeah, I'm not interested in people's commentary.

Just an addition: you can go to Meetup.com instead of downloading an app if you want. It's a little overwhelming in urban areas, where there's a meetup for every interest you can think of! In rural areas it's a bit easier to see all your options (because there are fewer of them).

They make protein hot chocolate. You can even buy them on this site. I have bought BariWise brand hot chocolate from Diet Direct and liked it. That would be a much better idea than normal hot chocolate.

My spouse knows, as do my brother and my aunt (who are both thinking of also getting it). Some close friends know that I'm having some kind of surgery, and I've talked about some of my feelings around the surgery without actually naming it, but they aren't stupid--they can probably guess, especially the two who have a close friend who has had it. My coworkers know I'm having "medical stuff," that will keep me away from work for a few weeks, and that is all I ever plan to tell them. (I don't work in a super healthy environment.) Same with my classmates. After the surgery and the worst of the pain is over I'll tell my mother. (I really like your phrasing/framing, @diabladepaz: "I don't have the emotional bandwidth" to deal with her issues when I'm already anxious, pre-op, nor will I immediately after, when I'm healing and tired and in pain and maybe going through the buyer's remorse phase.) And probably my less-close friends, as needed. Before I next see my in-laws (next summer), I'm probably going to get my partner to tell them, possibly with some kind of spiel like "Cranky is willing to answer questions about the procedure, about the rules people have to follow after it--any kind of general medical facts you might want to know. But they aren't willing to talk about their weight or to answer personal medical questions. Be cool." As I've said in most threads when this kind of conversation comes up, I'm willing to completely dodge people's questions ("I'm not comfortable talking about my weight/food choices/medical history/whatever. Anyway, how about those Dodgers?"), but I think it's cruel to ever tell another fat person we've lost all this weight through diet and exercise alone. I'll avoid the question, but I won't be deliberately misleading. It's been done to me (knowing what I know now, I suspect it's been done on at least three separate occasions), and it made me feel like an awful failure; I won't do it to another person.

Hey, @Oct517! My surgery is the day after yours, and I'm in the same boat. (I mean, sometimes during the day it also stresses me out, but there are distractions and things I have to do... at night it's just me, my worries, and my arthritis pain, and the stress is higher.) I don't have enough Xanax to get me through every night between now and the surgery (not by a long shot), but I have enough for a few key nights, like the night before. I'm considering trying a lavender tea + journaling ritual before bed, to get me through the other nights. (Chamomile would maybe be even better, if you aren't allergic to it.) I won't be in any less pain, but I will have gotten the worries out on paper so that I don't have to keep pondering them. Anyway, you're not alone. And we're going to be OK! ❤️

I was kind of hoping I could cheap out with sports bras for a while, that they might be a little more forgiving if I misjudge the cup size or something while I'm losing. No? Is that not a thing?

Yeah... the tone of this is definitely not my thing, but I'm glad that others found it motivating/helpful!

What @ChellNC said, but also, you're a sleever, and @Naughty Glitter Goddess is an RNYer. I bet the schedules have to be a little different between surgeries.

I have bought some of the protein soups (Bariwise broccoli cheddar -- they were rated highly, but I admit I haven't tried them yet), several boxes of no-sodium-added chicken bone broth (Jet.com sells them), a bunch of sugar-free Jello and sugar-free popsicles, some of the premade Muscle Milks (the 100 calorie ones), and Quest powder in vanilla and chocolate (pre-surgery, it's really only drinkable to me with some skim milk in there). I haven't had the meeting with the nutritionists, yet. There might be other things I can have that haven't occurred to me yet.

I described the one week liquid-only diet to my spouse (my team's version: 3 shakes or soups per day, plus unlimited clear, sugar-free things like broth and Mios). He looked kind of nervous and said "I think maybe I should go somewhere else that week and just come back to take you to the surgery." 😂 (I mean, he isn't wrong. I'm going to spend the entire week hangry.)

1) Thanks! These will come in handy when I hit that stage! 2) I'm glad someone else uses ramekins as bowls. I splurged on some cute ramekins, and that kind of was? my entire new small bowl budget? So I'm just going to eat everything from cute ramekins for a while. And now I feel extra good about it, because your presentation in these photos is fantastic! 3) My contribution to the thread, since fall is almost here (in the northern hemisphere): this pumpkin protein custard. I haven't tried it yet, but I'm very excited about it. I've done crustless, lower-sugar pumpkin pies for years, so adding protein powder and removing all the sugar is an obvious next step. I'm also really hopeful about this black bean soup. (Bonus: there is a bariatric-friendly plain egg custard linked from that page, too.)

😍😍😍😍

I should be clear: the only reason my rheumatologist is quibbling about this is that the American College of Rheumatology's new guidelines say not to go off methotrexate for surgeries--apparently, the increased risk of infection isn't as high as they previously thought. But I'm usually a pretty big fan of being over-cautious about health stuff. And if I'm off methotrexate for a month, I can get a flu shot and maybe have it work its full magic!

If you mean oral systemics and biologics like methotrexate or Otezla, that's worth a conversation with your team(s). I can tell you that my surgical team wants me to be off methotrexate for a month before and then to wait six weeks after surgery before restarting, and that's with a sleeve; my times might change, as they negotiate with rheumatology, who doesn't want me to stop my meds at all. (Honestly, regardless of what they end up deciding together, I'm not planning to restart methotrexate until my stomach is healed enough for solid foods, because it's pretty hard on the GI tract.) It seems like pills are a little harder on bypass patients, so you might end up having to switch to the injectable kind, to make methotrexate (for instance) work with a sleeve. If you mean injectables like Humira or Enbrel, again, it's going to require a conversation, but probably more with rheumatology than bariatrics. I don't know how long they want you to be off before surgery, or to wait afterward. But at least that kind of med won't make your stomach irritated! Now, if you mean NSAIDs (ibuprofen, Celebrex, etc.), the answer I've been given is "never." That's why I went with a sleeve, so I could take ibuprofen now and then, when the pain is too much to bear otherwise.