Over and Out

Here's a little tip I discovered last summer when I was too nervous to have the surgery: If you still have time before surgery, look at your local ads for garage sales and find the ones specifically advertising "plus-size clothes." Those can be big bonus buy places: I've found a lot of sales where the seller seems to have had WLS (I don't ask unless she/he is talking about it) and is selling a range of plus/XL sizes of clothes and also WLS books and the types of smaller tupperware, dishes, scales, measuring cups, and other handy kitchen items folks like us can use. Plus, it's like clothes shopping for the future! (Here in MN we only have a small weather window for these types of sales, and we're not even there yet--so it's get it while you can. . . and I've got some lovely clothes awaiting me from previous bargain hunting! :))

I agree completely. I wouldn't trust a ride that would take all sizes. https://saferparks.org/safety-tips/one-size-fits-all-ride-design

Does your doctor have the internet-based charts? Everywhere I go, I have to sign up for those stupid things. But I have noticed that if I send a doctor or nurse a question using that interface, they always reply. Because it is on your medical record as soon as you ask, and if they don't reply then they look bad. (In the past I've had so many doctors tell me unpleasant news on the phone, only to find out later there's not a word about those conversations in my records--drives me nuts!)

Hi all, I read through this thread last night and realized I was both lucky and horrified. Lucky, because my center gave me a binder similar to the one discussed. I find it surprising that some of you haven't received a whole lot more information from your docs pre-surgery. And horrified because I am a super-nerd book girl, and before my first seminar I had read every book about wls I could get my hands on. And every medical journal article on the subject available to me online. Why are you waiting until surgery to read the books you mention? They have fabulous suggestions for what to bring to the hospital, what to eat, recipes for each stage of recovery, etc. Not to mention dealing with emotions post op. And blow-by-blows of what you're going to feel like after surgery as you heal. If you own a kindle, Alex Brecher's The Big Book on the Gastric Bypass is only $9.99, as are the other "Big Books" (on Gastric Sleeve and Weight Loss Surgery). "Weight Loss Surgery for Dummies" is about $11.99. "The Emotional First-Aid Kit" is $9.99. And on and on. You can of course buy the paperback books as well. If you are a Prime member you'll find books you can read for FREE, and if you do Kindle Unlimited (or a month's free trial) you can find more free books than you'll know what to do with. (Sorry, I don't know about Nook or other Apps). Speaking of FREE, go to Amazon, find what you'd like to read, and then go to your local library and find it. Sometimes a book from the shelf, an interlibrary loan, sometimes borrowing electronically--you can almost always get your hands on what you need. Why wait until post-surgery to read about what it's like, and how to prepare for it? I think I'll be way too stupid with pain to read anything after surgery, but that's just me. I'm already like that half the time. I'm going to write very clear checklists for myself (and whoever might help me) on what to eat and when to take meds. Then it's just choosing the right level of silly for my TV watching--Steve Martin? The Princess Bride on endless repeat? Monty Python? Miranda Hart? French & Saunders? I always write too much. Sorry for that. (My family is trying to teach me how to text. Imagine how that's going).

Ummm. . . shouldn't you ask a medical professional about that?

Not happening. Right now that guy from NCIS and his friend from New Orleans are living rent-free in my head, so there's no room for you.

Oh, don't be silly. I asked them because I wanted to make sure I wasn't wrong. It's been a while since grad school, and science is always expanding its knowledge. Plus the biology teacher is my brother so I talk to him daily anyways (My other brothers? Engineers. Weird). It just sounded better to say I talked to a biology teacher than "I asked my brother. . . ." or "I asked my dad. . . ." (Context, ya know. ) No stalking here, I assure you. (Although I just realized the post I responded to on the Mayo Clinic diet was yours--no stalking intended, I am genuinely curious.)

I was "interviewing" a friend of a friend via email about her experiences with RNY (she and her husband both had it) because I only know one person who's had it who is alive and well (and I hadn't yet discovered these forums). This lady was a very matter-of-fact 50-ish woman who basically said "why on earth are you worried about THAT?" to every question I asked about possible side effects. She and hubby had no side effects. She has very thick hair, and when I said I was worried about hair loss she asked why! I told her it was a common side effect, and she says nope, neither one lost their hair. She didn't even know it could happen. Her guess was it was because they were very adherent to the nutritional requirements. After reading endless accounts of winning and losing the hair loss games, my guess is that they won some genetic lottery.

Yes, the Mayo Clinic is spectacular. It is nice to live close enough where there is always that last chance when all your local docs just can't seem to get it right. A question: I see that there is a ton of information online. And a diet you can do online (for a fee), plus the book you can purchase. May I ask which method you use? thanks! p.s. Funny story (at least to me): Around 1987 or so, when I was first out of college, I worked at Mayo Clinic for about a year (secretarial stuff). When I worked there I had their insurance plan--which paid for absolutely everything, as long as it was done at Mayo or an associated hospital. I had no idea how incredible that was. So when I left, they offered me COBRA coverage at $100 a month. I refused because it was "too expensive." I thought I was so smart in not letting "the man" take advantage of me by squeezing that $100 out of me each month. Good Grief.

I asked our local (masters-level) biology teacher about your logic here. I also asked my doctor, since I had an appointment today. Both say we share a common ancestor, from which point we took divergent paths (which is what I've been saying all along). They made me feel quite silly for asking. I was using your words, which you now say you did not mean. You are very specific and seemingly scientific (not "conversational") when talking about your diet and human biology; why not do the same when talking of evolution? I also resent your clear implication that remembering "who your audience is" means that I am somehow of lower intelligence. Though I will say I don't see a bit of humor in your tone, if that's what you were going for. This conversation is over. I suggest you spend 10 minutes talking to a biologist instead of cherrypicking internet articles to support your presuppositions.

Um...we're primates. So, we did. We're also Great Apes. So, again...we did:) You are misquoting me. I did not say that; I was quoting the article you posted to prove your point. But it specifically contradicts what you say.

Also: Creationist literature itself disproves the "deathbed conversion" baloney: https://answersingenesis.org/creationism/arguments-to-avoid/darwins-deathbed-conversion-a-legend/ Regarding carbon dating: radiocarbon dating is also known as C14 dating, since it depends upon measuring the half-life of C-14, a radioactive isotope of carbon. When I was an archaeologist, we used it all the time when we found burned material, to get a date on the site we were excavating. That's because C14 dating only works within a timespan of up to about 60,000 years ago. Since it only works in that time frame, it has no bearing whatsoever on the age of the earth. However, other kinds of radiometric dating work just fine, and prove the earth is over 4 billion years old. https://www.space.com/24854-how-old-is-earth.html and if you want to get really technical: https://ncse.com/cej/3/2/answers-to-creationist-attacks-carbon-14-dating I can't answer to your "huge study" because you cite no evidence.

What does Darwin have to do with modern evolutionary theory?

I suspect we are splitting hairs. But thanks for giving me something to think about besides my terror of gastric bypass! I don't work, so it's fun for me to be challenged a bit rather than surfing the web and watching TV. Stretching the brain feels good!

Yes, we are members of the taxonomic family Hominidae, and thus are great apes. Humans are also primates, mammals, chordates, animals, and Eukaryotes. A taxonomic family is, according to the Biology Online Dictionary, "A taxonomic group of one or more genera, especially sharing a common attribute. . . Organisms belonging to the same family would have evolved from the same ancestors and share relatively common characteristics" (my emphasis). Well, in your own words: The quote. . . Here's what follows in the text (my emphasis): The strong similarities between humans and the African great apes led Charles Darwin in 1871 to predict that Africa was the likely place where the human lineage branched off from other animals – that is, the place where the common ancestor of chimpanzees, humans, and gorillas once lived. The DNA evidence shows an amazing confirmation of this daring prediction. The African great apes, including humans, have a closer kinship bond with one another than the African apes have with orangutans or other primates. Hardly ever has a scientific prediction so bold, so ‘out there’ for its time, been upheld as the one made in 1871 – that human evolution began in Africa. The DNA evidence informs this conclusion, and the fossils do, too. Even though Europe and Asia were scoured for early human fossils long before Africa was even thought of, ongoing fossil discoveries confirm that the first 4 million years or so of human evolutionary history took place exclusively on the African continent. It is there that the search continues for fossils at or near the branching point of the chimpanzee and human lineages from our last common ancestor. And the chart. Here's what it says above it (my emphasis): "Primate Family Tree Due to billions of years of evolution, humans share genes with all living organisms. The percentage of genes or DNA that organisms share records their similarities. We share more genes with organisms that are more closely related to us. Humans belong to the biological group known as Primates, and are classified with the great apes, one of the major groups of the primate evolutionary tree. Besides similarities in anatomy and behavior, our close biological kinship with other primate species is indicated by DNA evidence. It confirms that our closest living biological relatives are chimpanzees and bonobos, with whom we share many traits. But we did not evolve directly from any primates living today. DNA also shows that our species and chimpanzees diverged from a common ancestor species that lived between 8 and 6 million years ago. The last common ancestor of monkeys and apes lived about 25 million years ago"

Hate to add to the anthropology rant. But great apes are not our ancestors. We share a common ancestor that lived 5 to 11 million years ago.

Your post is there. I just replied to it so it now appears up toward the top of the list

I'm replying to this not because I can help (unfortunately) but to show you that your post is here. I hit "follow" when I read it, so I was able to find it that way. Maybe if I write something it will "bump" it back up to the top of the list where others can see it.

Well, if it's the first time he's ever seen you he might be reluctant to refer you for major surgery and want to try more conservative measures first, like appetite suppressants. You don't have to take the prescription if you don't want to, especially if you are not diabetic. I guess if you just want the referral, you need to find another doctor.

So this is your Primary Care doctor but this is the first time you've seen him? Are you diabetic? I don't understand when you say not one, but two. Is there another doctor who has refused a referral?

Hello, As my name suggests, I am still not sure about having weight loss surgery, although I am going through the program (I am on my 3rd month). As I follow the nutrition guidelines I'm realizing a scary thing--I am a seriously picky eater, so much so that I don't see a lot of options post surgery. I know that taste preferences change, but how much? Will I start liking foods I've hated my entire life? Or will I start hating the few foods I do like? I've been picky since I was a kid, and as I have been practicing my new eating guidelines for the past few months, things have not turned out well when I try new things (from stomach aches to just plain gagging the food right back up). So here's my problem: From the two-page list of proteins they gave me, I like eggs, beans, plain baked chicken, peanut butter, bland deli-type turkey, and plain roast beef. I've found that the "chew fifty times" rule has been troublesome for chicken and roast beef--they get stringy and hard to swallow, and my nutritionist says they may not be something I can eat post-surgery. I can wolf down a hamburger, but chewing it 50 times turns it into a gag-inducing crumble of meat, so they are out. I don't like steak or any other form of beef. I do like nuts but have been getting ill every time I eat them; too much fat, I think. No cheese cubes, cottage cheese, yogurt, or tofu (I have been trying for 30 years to get these down). No fish or other seafood or meats. I'm sensitive to salt and seemingly every kind of spice, so my attempts at making meals a bit less boring have been failing spectacularly. No salad dressings, marinades, or other kinds of sauces. Almost any kind of pre-made dinner tastes too salty to eat. Most fruits are too tart. How on earth am I going to get enough protein in after surgery? Right now I am supplementing with protein shakes while I'm figuring things out, but I am determined to live my life eating real food once I've fully recovered from surgery. And I'm really scared I won't be able to eat any foods.

Thank you everyone for your help and ideas! It is really nice to have a sounding board and have ideas flying at me for what to do. It helps so much for me, because there is no one to talk with in person. Happy Monday, everyone!

Alas, it does. It may sound weird, but milk is my favorite food. I grew up on a farm where all the kids just guzzled it like water. I drink it with everything! So I had a loooong talk with the nutritionist about it. She said it is liquid calories and they fill up the pouch too fast. We can't drink with meals anyway. And nothing caloric between meals, so I would have no chance of drinking it. Your idea of checking out a different surgeon is a possibility. I did have another post on here about just that, based on geographical distance and lifetime follow-up appointments. I am seeing a physician in the "other" place this week, to talk about their non-surgical weight loss program. I'm going to see if I can get a quick walk-through their bariatric surgery section and answers about their eating plan. Thanks for your help! I do appreciate it.

We can't drink any beverage unless it's calorie-free, so milk and juice are out. And of course we can't drink with meals. I am just now re-reading my manual--it says to eat 1 oz of food over 15 minutes and chew to an applesauce texture. I don't know where I got 50 chews from, the nutritionist must have said it. I do remember being a bit upset because I have TMJ disorder and chewing that much hurts. The other thing it says is after the healing phases after surgery, protein shakes and bars are not a part of the diet. Three meals a day, real food. That's good. I'll just have to be patient, I guess. They have a highly structured process, but at this point I have no one to talk to except the nutritionist. I haven't even met with my surgeon yet, or anyone who can answer the questions I have. That all comes in another couple of months. It's a bit frustrating, to say the least.