snuffy65

This is funny. First you say people are arrogant because they assumed you don't know what theory means. Then you go off and prove them right by trying to legitimize creationism as a "theory" to be taught in school. All theories in school are SCIENTIFIC THEORIES in which theories are backed up with scientific facts. Here's one deifnition: When God comes down from the heavens and submits to genetic testing and a polygraph test let me know. I will support you all the way.

I never was a beer guy, so most of the guys I have a guy night out with already expect me to get something else. Some suggestions: White russian (my favorite) Margarita Screwdriver Mai Tai Long Island Ice Tea( another favorite, with just a splash of coke) Bloody mary A manly version of a BM would be a "Bloody Bull" (surprisingly goes down great and you get some vegatables and Protein out fo the deal)

Me and my wife went through the process. It was easy. However the nurse assured us that the donation place cannot guarrantee the eggs would be used. We did this not for the eggs but in case somone else could use them.

We do agree. I was pointing out the fact here in America most acts of racism is due to stereotyping rather then the old fashion definition of racism which is to think one race is superior to another. My comment about your relationship is not a low blow because this story has nothing to do about the view of someone be disciminated against but rather the view from the people doing the discriminating. This story made no assumptions on WHY poor people act the way they do. Sure, tell me your in hospitality and you disagree with what people do at work. Thats fine, but bringing personal relationships into a race discussion, especially when it had nothing to do with what I was saying and making it sound like your more qualified and I should "educate myself more" was a low blow cause: 1. You don't know my income status 2. You don't know my relationships 3. Again, your affliations doesn't matter in this story

I'm saying there is a huge amount of eggs created and not enough people who would use the donated eggs. So eventually they will die.

I understand the language might be a bit harsh, but jeez, coming from a poor white family I used it all the time. In the business we called each other names. When ever I jumped on the flat top (which was the middle kitchen line area) and the manager came in and saw black guys on each side of the line and me in the middle I would shout its Oreo night in the kitchen! Everyone had a blast. I called them G-Money, they called me vanilla ice. I called them haters, they called me Opie. This is the deal with the race thing. Everyone so jumpy on what people say, so eager to call foul but never listen to the message. No wonder no one in this country will touch the issue publicly. Also, your interacial relationships have no bearing. I've got my own, but I ain't going to list them out like its some badge to be a racism police. Actually that was my point of the story. The servers may thought it was a black thing or a money thing. But in their prism of that town almost every black person acted like that. Its not my fault that its the truth. I learned from dealing with that situation that it actually was a money thing and not a racial thing. However a bit of racism was in involved since EVERY black person was considered a "bad" table even to the black servers. Exactly my point. Poor white people seemed just inclined to act up and not tip as much as poor black people. This is the whole point of the story! People act a certain way. In this situation, poor people act rudely and don't tip. Since 95% of the black people in that area are poor they mostly acted like that. However, when your a server, what is easier to figure out by just looking at the table? Thats right, thier skin color. And in there lies the racism. I wouldn't call the servers racists however, because they are just making an observation that is 95% correct. Is it black peoples fault? No, I believe past oppression of the black community is at fault and the stereotypes that come with 95% of your race being in one end of the economic spectrum. To illustrate my point I got another one for you (this will piss all you ladys off). If its busy, good servers will try and avoid a table full of woman in their section. Reason being. Woman aren't regarded as the best tippers, usually take longer to order, and tend to sit after meals alot longer locking your section up. Now is that sexist that a server would rather have couples or a group of men sit at there tables when its busy? I think so. But is the stereotype 90% correct? You bet, at least in that area. I am not trying to defend why poor people do it. I know why they do it. My point was the black people were not being discriminated directly cause they were black, but rather their tendancies to be poor in that area. :w00t: Sorry, but I had that point of view. My family lived just above the poverty line for most of my childhood. I knew why my poor extended family did those rotten things and glad my parents knew better. Worked out better for us, cause we were the first to have built some actual wealth.

Yah, I'm sure all those eggs get through screenings and qualifies. What about the couples that don't qualify? Oh I forgot this is perfect world.

The only problem is thats how its done. What they do with the other "babies" that weren't used.

I didn't want to answer all the questions except one. Yes there is still racism. However instead I wanted to tell a interesting racial story. Long ago I worked for a still famous restaurant chain. I bartended their when I first started and it always amazed me listening to servers fight about which tables they are going to get. So over the years I became a server myself and started noticing no one ever wanted to take the table full of black people. Now this is where it gets funny. I learned pretty soon the reason my fellow servers and I didn't want to take them. 9 out of 10 times the black table would complain about EVERYTHING and demand free food and whether the complained alot or not never left more then their coin change for a tip. This went on and on and we gained a couple of black servers over time. They too would be discourage about tables full of blacks. One day one of the black servers was almost done with her shift and a table of black people sat in her section. She asked me to take them and I said sure but you said haven't gotten many tables today and I thought maybe you would want to make a little more before you went home. She looked at the table, then looked at me shaking her head and said "shooooot you know there's no money on that table". Take what you want from this story. I took from my lessons at that restaurant that sometimes its not about people thinking their race is better then others, but from people's perception of a race in their own environment. I wasn't racist, the black server surely wasn't racist. But we knew that 95% of the black people in that city came from one area of town and it wasn't the good one. At my time serving, you could tell after talking with the customers who had money and who didn't. It was easy to pick out the white trailer trash after giving them their drinks and watching them. White trailer trash treated us the same as those black tables and tip like them too. The difference between the two were we could tell someone was black right when they came out the door. I know this is not friendly story but its reality. I worked in the hospitality business a long time and in alot of different places. Again, take what you will from it.

I just got my date, but its not till june 24th. However I already got the nervous/excited feeling. Will you folks report back when you get home after surgery?

Just got mine approved! June 24th!:thumbup:

gratz, both of you!

Yep, those are the downsides of the Lap Band. But there are upsides too. Also, the not losing fast enough claim are mostly bogus since most of those complainers are only losing 1-2lbs a week which is how it was intended. If doctors could regulate weight loss for otheer WLS surgeries they would try for 1-2 lbs a week also. After my 6 monts of research I found that most complaints about the Lap Band are the same with other sugeries. People can gain weight back and/or plateau with any other surgeries. People have to be on a specific diet with all surgeries. All other complaints are minor. Except maybe fills. Fills will be a pain if you don;t have a good surgeon and/or you live far away from where you get the fills.

In vitro involves inducing the woman to grow many eggs then extracting them. Then those eggs, 10-30 of them are all fertilize, which now in your eyes are human beings. Then the Doctor chooses which favorite two or three and freezes the rest. If the mother gets pregnant then the doctor can either keep the rest frozen or throw them away, or decide to send them out for research purposes Its not just for genetic selections but yes it does destroy the sperm/egg. All known birth controls pills works in preventative ways. Yet they all harden the uterine wall so that the embryo cannot attach. And what I am saying its obvious that you didn't know all the different ways that embryos are destroyed everyday. Unfortunately most prolifers do know and try to "rationalize" why they support embryo destruction that way but not in an abortion. This includes people like gadget who say they would be lenient on woman who have abortions, which I have no idea why if they are indeed killing "human beings". Prolife people can't have it both ways. Either the embryos are humans and we treat them that way, or they are not humans. Either way, I at least respect the fact that you are firm in the belief that embryos are humans and need to be treated that way.

Anyways, its obvious prolifers want to except embryos as human life when they talk about abortions and thats it. I do not know why you folks are so adiment about "life at conception" as being the same as a born baby, teenager, and adult, yet let people destroy those same lives everyday doing other things. If you truly believe God wants it your way, well may God have mercy on your souls. Anyways, gadget and I been argueing for this awhile and seems like we just repeat ourselves and was fun and interesting. I am a bit tired of the repetition. CYA! Stay safe all!

Nope, saying a hunk of come human tissue can be kept alive, nourished , and growing for many years. Your right earlier, when you said science changes definitions everyday. And more and more the definition of live needs to change with it.

I already answered all those. Thats not the only definitions on life and yet all those could explain living tissue. There is a big difference of living tissue and a human life as we know it to be. As a matter of fact many scientists make this assumption everyday. I am glad to aswer questions, just not a hundred times. However, becuase of this statment I wont dignify any question from you any further. I have never made those claims and probably never will for arguements for prochoice. Thanks for trying to pigeon hole me. But if you want you can answer me these. Are you for making in vitro illegal? Are you for making Birth Control pills illegal? Are you for making embyrionic research illegal?

If your right there is alot more then 1,300,000 lives being killed every year in the US. You are so set on claiming a fertilized egg is a human life, yet you want to set a double standard on that human life? The reason religion fits so much in the debate is if you truly believe in human life at conception, then there would be no legal birth control pills. No legal invitro procedures. No embryonic stem cell research. Most of which a "true" Christian ironically doesn't have to worry about. A true Christian: Thinks sex is only for procreation and definitely not before marriage Doesn't believe in invitro Thinks embryonic research is immoral anyways. How convenient that Christians can stand up be sooo against something that doesn't effect them.

I'm Christian and pro choice. But please don't ask me why because we would have to get into theology and won't help any side.

Ya and my point was unmarried people are more inclined to get abortions because of the stigma , especially from people of faith! You are so way out there. Um there is more religions out there then evangelicals and catholics. I think the second largest is protestants. So those numbers are bunk. I say huh? Saying teenagers, blacks, and Hispanics having unplanned pregnancies has no bearing on the effects of religion nor abortions. Whats the abortion rates of those blacks, Hispanics, and teenagers unplanned pregnancies compared to others? Answer tat and you might have something. What you quoted from them says nothing. Sure go for it Its still a prolife site :crying: Actually was hoping you would say this because its funny how you look at these statistics and say you got something here to prove when in fact is your making yourself look bad. Your right ,because people like you try to distort them to say what you want. I guess you can say the same thing about me except I use reasoning and common sense when reading them. All it proves again is prolife people don't look at the science, numbers, or anything that would be used in a court of law which is why you will never win.. This is most definitely about feelings because it is your FEELING that life begins at conception. It is your FEELINGS that you think abortionists are murderers. It is your FEELING that this doesn't happen in your social circle prevalently. Screw numbers, screw facts, screw science, lets pass a law on your gut FEELING. No thanks!

In BJean's defense, she said "some" for both religious and homeschooling parents. Which is both true. I've seen alot of people say they took their kids out not only for homeschooling but just out of public to private, just on the "sex education" classes. So the word some is appropriate since BJean doesn't have statistics. There has been statistics on abstenence only teachings and there is a higher rate of unintentional pregnancies then others. The fact is children have sex whether we want them to or not. Some parents get lucky and have the ability, situation, and family make up, to keep their children from having sex till post teens. Unfortuantly, more often then not the teens will have sex so personally I would want them to have at least the knowledge of what to do.

I agree totally except for the stigma part. I didn't even include the pressure from the fathers. After reading some posts of yours you seem to have a good handle on how you raise your children. However, teenage pregnancy is not the total issue I was bringing up. I just wish we could work more on preventing unintentional pregnancies and the ones that do happen help them to make the right decision. But either way, like every other abortion thread, this one has gotten off track. The only issue in the long run is viability of the fetus. "When", is the big part and there will be no disuading someone on this issue IF they made up their mind "when" viability is. I think it is futile to go on with the discussion until some new information rises.

However, there is stigma about being pregnant and not married regardless of religion which we do know (unlike your assumption of what people actually do with their religous beliefs) is true. Yes, alot of people who consider themselves Christian have been taught their faith and even if they stop going to church they already been taught what they "should" do with their lives and also they are still surrounded with fellow christians. And when most people think about decisions in life they consider others reactions as well. I know it shouldn't, but thats the way it is. My point is lets not pass laws just to "lower" the abortion rate. There are plenty of other ways of doing. The reason I brought up the religion issue is that alot of people Pro-choice and pro-life are all trying to lower the rate but are always blocked by the "no sex, no abortion" people who can't understand statisically they're way isn't working.

yes, because all of those women think "hey if I get pregnant I will just get an abortion."

Do you even read what you posted? The post fooled you on that one. First that says those people have "unintended pregnancies" not abortions. 2nd it says 47% of "unintended pregnancies" end up in abortions, but never put 2 & 2 together. Duhhhh. 3rd, this doesn't prove me wrong becuase what you would be telling me is tat most black, Hispanic, and teenagers, don't have any religious affiliations. Thats dumb assertions. This also proves my point that unmarried woman are shunned and so talk down to about not getting pregnant they feel that the need to get an abortion. So 22% of women are catholic the US and 27% of abortions are by catholic women? All that tell me is your 5% more likely to get an abortion which also proves my point. Heres a picking from a more extensive poll, from no other then an prolife site( Abortion Statistics ). Women identifying themselves as Protestants obtain 37.4% of all abortions in the U.S.; Catholic women account for 31.3%, Jewish women account for 1.3%, and women with no religious affiliation obtain 23.7% of all abortions. 18% of all abortions are performed on women who identify themselves as "Born-again/Evangelical". Which tells me 76.3% are people who are preached about abstinence and no sex and all that fun stuff. Please read your stuff before cutting pasting from Prolife sites and just assume it backs you up.