Skywalker

Spoke to a MH counselor again about the WL surgery issue and we tossed around a LOT of ideas.....ranging from nutrition to religion/death. I'll come right out and ask you guys: Did the prospect of dying under general anesthesia or surgical complications ever hinder or worry you guys, or was it just kind of rolled into the choice and filed under "acceptable risk"? This is something I grapple with, more some times, and less others.

Really great point, I could not have put it better myself. The reactions I get from people are almost like I am breaking a rule or a law, rather than undergoing a procedure that could really help me overall. About 75% of those I've told (most of whom are healthcare personnel) seem to emote a quiet judgment, like they really disapprove of this. I catch myself thinking that if I had been addicted to cocaine/meth/alcohol, and came to them, they would extend their arms and be a lot more supportive, trying to give me a hand up out of the problem since I'd sought help. And yet, I've done none of those (illegal) things, kept my nose clean and tried to diet hard, and catch tons of crap just for wanting a WL procedure. Like you mentioned, I'm almost treated like a criminal.

Has anyone else dealt with something like this? Who have you shared the info with that you are having or have had surgery with? What have you told people after the surgery when they ask about your weight loss??? I know how you feel, Erin. Other people's reactions can be really frustrating, mostly because they don't give you the benefit of the doubt/think you've really tried anything, and they haven't walked miles in your shoes. The overall impression I get from people I tell is disappointment/sadness, almost like they think I'm a fool or I'm "going under the knife" for lazy, cosmetic reasons. This couldn't be further from the truth--I want my health and energy back. Some remain unconvinced even when I tell them of my current high cholesterol, back pain, diet attempts, difficulty finding clothes that fit and finding jobs, etc. Like beating my head on a brick wall. My husband's approval (at least financially) is all I need at this point--screw everyone else. I've decided the best policy is to tell as few people as possible, it's not their body and just not their business. And afterwards, when they ask how I did it, I'm going to tell them Weight Watchers worked really well. It won't be a lie, exactly--I'm still going to follow my points to some extent and exercise, technically Weight Watchers and all it's taught me about Protein, Fiber, fat, and food choices will be at play in my mind.

That's funny. I'm actually not planning on telling anyone I got this done, so when they ask 100 lbs from now, I'm just going to say Weight Watchers worked really well this time. It might be a little bit like stolen valor/taking credit for something that's not mine, but I figured with all the efforts I've put into diets over the previous years I've "earned" it many times over....... (if that makes any sense)

Always erring on the side of caution with this, I'd say at least pay a walk in clinic a visit and see what they have to say.

I don't know what the time period is but my bariatric surgeon said the signs of a leak where the typical "flu" signs, such as fever, malaise, aches, fatigue, sweats, that sort of thing. Normally this is stuff I'd blow off and wait for to pass, but post WLS I'd run right to the ER at the first sign of that.

Probably the last diet I went on (Weight Watchers) that lasted for about two years, where the weight lost after much struggle was 30 lbs. I still had a good 50 lbs to go. Like I said, I hungered, I exercised, I cried on the weeks where it hovered or even gained a little, and fought for every one of those lbs. Then I had one four month semester where I didn't log everything, and 40 lbs came back on. I was utterly done at that point. I realized that (1) I'm serious about wanting to get the weight off (2) I can't do it by myself/need the sleeve's help. I'm also tired of using pictures of myself from several years back and not just being able to go to Penneys once a year to get a decent family picture taken. I look ginormous and am far too embarrassed to use it for cards.

Congratulations, that must feel wonderful....but is that healthy? 72 lbs in 3 months is about 6 lbs per week.....

I'm in Colorado (Medicaid) and it seems to be a six month thing. Each month you have to weigh in with your doctor and they have to note: current diet, weight, and exercise attempts. Then at the end I guess the Dr. refers you. There's also (in the 6 month meantime) a psychological approval and some nutrition classes I have to take. I have no idea if this is easy or hard to get approved, but I've heard good things.

I haven't had the surgery yet, but I can only liken these stories to when I get the flu--my cravings change. While normally, I would really like pizza, chips, wine, and whatnot, when I get the flu my cravings shift to a desire for bland oatmeal, chicken noodle Soup, and diet sprite. The other foods I would normally crave repel me a bit because they seem to lack nutrition and things (especially the wine) feel uncomfortably "rough" going down. These, of course, are the weeks where I have lost 5 lbs.

I do this and feel so much better...I didn't know it had a name! On the other hand, just doubling your meds is very dangerous! Without a Dr's supervision (and blood test to monitor) it certainly is. Also, I'd forgotten about Water and soda. Some sources will say if you cut out regular soda it might be the answer to all diet things. Well....it is good, but not enough. My husband cut out regular soda several years ago (only drinks diet) and just tipped the scales recently at the highest weight of his life, over 270 lbs. And then there's the "drink more water, it will fill you up". In my experience, it's a good supplement to a meal and will hydrate, but if I just sit around drinking lots of water, my stomach starts growling and it leads inevitably to more hunger....

I've gotten a couple stupid pieces of advice: A friend recently, who is hypothyroid, mentioned she might take more than the usual dose of levothyroxine to speed up her metabolism, and I warned her not to do that as it could actually cause more issues with the thyroid (I'd actually rate this under the "dangerous" category, if there was one). The VA MOVE program told us to "eat less, exercise more" (because we've never heard this before, anywhere) and to "take the stairs at work" (look, if you're pushing 300 lbs and you take the stairs once or twice a day, it won't help, sorry. What might help is 30+ minutes per day, 4+ days per week on stairs, at your target heart rate, and not a minute less).

Possibly. I'm not trying to start a shitstorm here (so apologies in advance to any religious people), but the counselor I saw is Mormon, and they inherently disapprove of alcohol and caffeine anyway. In addition to this, one of his relatives had the surgery and gained all of the weight back because she kept eating crap. So I don't know if any of this played a role in his negative review. I'm a disabled veteran, and he also mentioned in the psych report that I had a rating for major depressive disorder, and I kind of don't like that being out there that way. Not that it's anything to be ashamed of, exactly, but it is my personal business and really doesn't keep me from being productive and living life (I still go to work and work hard, and I still have a 3.8 GPA at college). The irony here is that my massive weight is a large part of my self esteem issues and contributes to any unhappiness I have in a major way, so denying me the surgery wouldn't be doing my health any favors.

@CowgirlJane: All very good points, and I like the scenarios you ran through for people with the wrong mindsets. There are a couple people I used to work with, and they both had bariatric surgery. One is still keeping the weight off, and the other isn't. I had lunch with the successful one (she'd banded) the other month to pick her brain and see what it is all about. She says she still has some demons and daily choices to make, but overall she's so much better and healthier. FYI she looks great in pictures, too. The other lady, who appears to me to be really heavy, apparently did the whole thing where she ate whatever she wanted and went back to her original size.

All really good advice, thanks. The Starbucks wasn't a daily thing, and it was an honest mistake, because I don't have it a lot, but I see now why I definitely shouldn't have brought it in with me--in a way, I was "performing" for him to achieve a desired result, and I didn't really pass the test. In fact, I'm pre-op now, and I can't think of the last time I had a Starbucks. I came to the conclusion (without dieting) in the last couple months that I would rather grab an Egg McMuffin on the way to work because it fills me up and the protein/heat makes me feel better than the morning Starbucks sweetness, which makes me hungry about an hour later. The weird thing now is, I submitted this letter to my bariatric surgeon's office, and even though I thought the psych eval was a tepid piece of crap, she thinks it's just fine. She said she's never seen a patient get denied with a "guarded" rating for a psych eval. Regardless, I pushed her for the list her office has of psychiatrists, and think I'm going to follow that route. The insurance approval that's at stake is worth $17,000, so I don't want to give them any excuse to deny.

Yes, I believe I did, but I think there may have been more than one way to read that. The way I meant it was--getting this surgery will not take away anyone's eating disorder. This is what I have studied and been told by people who got WLS. Whatever was going on in their mind prior to the surgery--they still have to work on that. Do you disagree with this? Yes if you have reading suggestions I'll take them, thanks.

@InfiniteButterfly: The Starbucks is something you would not be able to have post-surgery. Definitely not immediately, and with the amount of sugar in even the non-fat varieties, it's definitely a very, very occasional treat (if even that. I used to LOVE non-fat, no-whip green tea frappucinos pre-surgery. I took one look at the sugars post-surgery and said goodbye forever) When you say you don't have Starbucks, etc. anymore, is that because you just don't want it, or is it forbidden for some reason? I've read conflicting things on the sleeve/WLS, but I'm learning all I can. Some people discuss head hunger, while others state that it biologically altered what they actually can eat and/or crave from that point on. And honestly, if your goal post-surgery is to follow Weight Watchers? I don't know that it's nutritionally sound for a bariatric patient. You would need to discuss that with a nutrition counselor (I know from when I tried Weight Watchers that there was a helluva lot of food that I couldn't possibly eat post-surgery or likely ever) I'm not really sure what the "right" answer is for a psych consult, all I can say is that I'm not a lazy WLS candidate. I've done a lot of things in my life, up to and including being an athlete, and I've never been non-compliant with medical advice. I don't, by any means, plan to eat small amounts of unhealthy foods until my stomach expands to its original size, because I've seen WLS people do that and think it's such a waste. I want to get thin again and stay healthy. @Moonlitestarbright: since you havent done your nutritional counseling, how are you supposed to know? go get your nutritional counseling and then another psych eval. i think you might have put the cart before the horse. Right....how would I know? I'm not non-compliant and I'm not post op (yet); I'll follow whatever diet plan the doctor deems appropriate, because I want to heal and look good and keep it off for the rest of my life. Perhaps you were right that I put the cart before the horse. I don't believe I'm a bad candidate for surgery, because I've molded my diet to a lot of different things before and adhered to them (Weight Watchers, South Beach, etc.). The hunger, at least on Weight Watchers, is what is currently getting me to surpass the points I'm allotted, so I thought stomach reduction and getting the hunger hormone cut out would be especially helpful.

Misslex, I understand the hesitation with money; if money was not a consideration, I would have already had a WLS and be on my way now. From what I understand, insurance companies will cover one WLS in your lifetime. If you were self pay for the band, can you Dr. annotate the slippage/complication and try to get you in for the sleeve? I know the savings of 17,000 would sure seem worth it to jump through a few hoops.

I just want to make sure I'm understanding this correctly....did they disapprove you because you were two pounds too thin and had no co-morbidities?

bikrchk--I haven't had the sleeve nutritional classes yet, but when you mentioned the Protein intake, how does your doctor(s) advise you to balance that? We have protein powder in my house, and my daughter in particular loves it, but her PCP said no more than one a day or it's hard on her kidneys. I assume the same will be true for me for the long term post op diet....was just wondering if they tell people to fall within a certain protein range post op for the rest of their life (not too much and not too little)

bikrchk--On the note of nutrition, has anyone found (post op especially) V-8 drinks helpful? Noticing that I don't tend to get a lot of vegetables normally, I have tried to drink one or two of these a day (and have my daughter do the same) to get some valuable nutrients. I would think, being liquid, that these might also be easily consumed post surgery.

That's all I want is a fighting chance. I don't think my current provider wants to give it to me. God damn the VA.

Excuse me (to everyone)--When people say "the nut" to what are they referring? I used to think it was the lap band but the sleevers use this term too, so I'm confused.

Go to the hospital right away. If you are feeling dizzy it probably means your blood pressure is low because of low fluids in the bloodstream (an IV would help this). I'm not a post op patient (yet), but I went to the hospital last year for gastroenteritis--so a lot of throwing up and diarrhea--and could have died without the IV assistance.

"i have found there are a lot people around here who are still poorly educated about basic nutrition post op. maybe that is what he means? do you have an idea of what you would need to eat post op to get 60-80 grams of Protein per day?" I did hear that, and I've been trying to learn as much about the surgery as possible to be successful. I will literally follow any plan my Dr. wants me to. I understand the higher protein is important for wound healing; the first time I heard this was actually after I had my C-Section, and the protein/wound healing connection was solidified during my medical training (I'm a CNA). I have a couple cases of the Premier Protein Drink stored in the garage right now to have pre and post op. Edit: I think each of those Premier Protein drinks is about 30 grams of protein per drink, I'll have to check again and correlate it with the nutrition requirements.