Filosophia Scandinavia

Sweetie I once had a BMI on 26, I felt all wrong (had 4 liposuctions!), - asked my doctor for diet pills. She wouldnt give it too me, because I wasn't overweight. And they has side effects that wasn't healthy I cried and really felt dissapointed - that my doc let me down. Now, 10 years later,when I have a lot higher and unhealthy BMI, I wonder why I was ever thinking I was fat then. I was so beautiful. I would love to be back on a BMI on 26 again. I know how difficult it is when you feel big, and others can not see it. Please try other healthy methods, and perhaps talk with someone you can trust. Consider Overeaters A - it is a nice place. I do not think a surgeon would consider you as a patient. How much would you like to loose to be satisfied?

A great answer - a good one to answer! PRE-OP, my ten reason for having the operation are: 1.To get rid of my sleep apnea and somewhat high blood pressure, 2. Less snoring - will be able to sleep next to someone again 3. To live longer and perhaps become more fertile (36 - no children yet - but mayby in the future. I dont know if I want any) 4. To get some load off my stomach, so I would have less pain in my lower back 5. To be able to run for more than 30 seconds, without having joint pain. 6. DANCE freely- not feeling heavy and stange when I am moving my body 7., To be confident again, when I meet people from the old days - when I had a normal weight. 8. I am a stylist: To choose some of the clothes for my self, I use and write about for others. 9. To feel more attractive. To be the best woman, I can be. 10. to feel more the FREEDOM - my most important value in life. Freedom from the extra weight. Will be back in a half year, and make a follow up on this!

Pre-op - what will I think? Wondering about that too. Nice question, got me thinking On the table, lights on, nurses, doctors around me. All kind of machines bipping.. "What am I doing - is this the right thing? Will this really work? Should I have underwent the bypass instead?" I think I will prepare myself. I use voice recordings alot. Listening to my thoughts. Using them as a motivator on my MP3 Will tell my self all the great things thatn will know happend. So my brain is more focused on that,than´what could go wrong.

I have the same "problem". It is somewhat a good thing, because I feel more confident. If I could really see my, as I see on photos, I would hide a lot more. But I also like curved women. I am having my surgery in a month and you got me thinking. How will I see my self after WLS? Probably a lot more skinny, that I really am. OR? I remember, when I was underweight 15 years ago - I saw myself as normal. I am sure, that I can see the difference. Maybe it will feel like coming home. Back to the body, I really want to be in. I was a plus size model a couple a month ago - feeling confident before, but when I saw the photos. WHAT!!!!!!??? I would want anyone to see them, but it was too late, and they were used, so a lot of people from my old shool, earlier boy friends ect must have seen them. :camera: So strange. I am really curious, how I will se myself when loosing the extra baggage. My sister also see herself as more skinny. She was operated with a BMI on 40, is now down to 33 and feel all normal. She has subscribed to a dating site, writing she has a normal weight. She asked me, if it was OK, if people would see her as normal? I told her, that a lot would probably see her as curvy girl, but not normal - she didnt like the answer. She still need to loose 40-50 pounds to be in the "normal" section. She cant see it herself. She is wearing really tight clothes already. I am glad she feels so confident, and wouldnt want to say anything -she really is beautiful. I would not wear leggings and a short t-shirt, having the same BMI. She is celebrating all the weight coming off:wub: She is looking so great and healthy - but I feel that she sees herself as a different size and much more skinny, than she really is. Just like I would do. Using her as an example for what I would do and see when loosing weight. I will probably see the same - when loosing a lot of weight, I will probably see myself in the normal category, before I really am. Will be back in half a year and give you an updateB)

It is interesting to hear someone who IS hungry after the operation. Even in a different way. Perhaps a little optimistic, I hoped for no hunger the first half year. But mayby I am lucky. Will see. ABOUT WATER Mayby I have misunderstood it. BUT: My surgeon told me, that fluids will not stay long in the stomach, it wil go directly through - it is not long enough in the stomach, to produce the needed pressure. Something solid will do it. It is also so important not to drink calories, but we all know that

Any news - are you better:unsure:?

LilMissDiva, you are a clever girl. Thank you! I just talked with my surgeon 10 minutes ago, booking the operation. And I asked about this. He told me, it was true. That other hormones- who were located in the intestines, and had to do with hunger, did increase over time, when the ghrelin decreased. But not in the first 18 month. And in the first 18 month, you loose almost all of the excess weight. It was almost impossibel to gain weight again after the 18 month, because of the small stomach. BUT, he said, a lot of the patients didn't experience the same hunger as before the operation. Just like you decribe! Yeah, that made me calm, It is not like before the operation. Something has changed. I like the way, you decribe your hunger. I would simply LOVE AND WORSHIP that missing feeling forever. Just 30% less of the hunger, I have know, would help me to loose weight. I understand, why you consider the plication. The pressure receptors works fine in a sleeve plication. So why cut the stomach out? You cant cut the ghrelin out. Do the decrease in ghrelin work just as fine in a plication? Anyone? I really feel, that I have made the right choice - I am so thankful that I found this forum

I just talked with my surgeon 10 minutes ago. He gave me 4 dates to choose from in late November! So I will be a November Sleever too! I live in Denmark, but will have the operation in Greece - Athens.

I THINK THIS IS THE MOST INTERESTING PART - I didnt know that: "There are probably many pharmaceutical companies working on an "anti-ghrelin" drug but it is likely that even if such a drug is created and works, the other hormones involved in appetite will increase over time reducing its effectiveness." If the other hormones "take over" over time - then the reduced hunger from the operation will decrease over time? Has anyone in this forum been operated for 5-10 years or more? But we still have the smaller stomach, if the antighrelin effect subside. Will the feeling of hunger then be the same, as many with the lapband experience?

Thank you for answering, Eureka C! I am sorry for your brother - but it is nice to know, that it kan be fixed! Now I understand - and it is easier to get the hernias , the more overweight you are, because of the musclestreching = weak spots! Perhaps the surgery gave the hernias a chance "come out". Mayby Im not so prone to have them, when I am "only" 60-70 pounds overweight. It should be so painful - and very dangerous. But he probably already knew he would come back with them, so he reacted quickly on the pain, I would guess. And thank you for your earlier message, you probably have already seen my answers Have a wonderful day!

Hello - I am a danish woman, trying to loose weight. ME: 36 years old BMI: "only" 33 Comorbidities of my weight: sleep apnea High bloodpressure Lower back problems are getting worse for every pound overweight (scoliosis/ Ishias problems) Father diabetes 2, both mother and father are medicatet for hight bloodpressure. Sister underwent a Gastric Bypass en roux with a BMI of 40 with great succes :rose: I have tried almost every diet on earth, undergoing lifestyle changes, have been in therapy, have spent a lot of money on al kinds of thing.Iron, Calcium and Proteins, that I am digesting.:confused2: Futhermore it seems that a sleeve operation is having a lower mortality rate and fewer post complications?:confused: One of the reasons why I am overweight is the earlier use og sugar as a coping strategy for everything. I have worked through most of this - but see it as somekind of a dependency even if I do not use it as much as before. And this is not good with the sleeve? :eek: Does anyone in this forum have eny experiences with. If some of my earlier eating habits are due to cognitive habits, lower ghrelin secretion will not help me? Or?:confused1: All you comments are welcome - my brain is exploding I already know, that my BMI is low (but high enough to die earlier), and I am mostly considering an operation because og my health issues. Just a few words, please?:angel:

Dear Tiffany Once again, thank you so much for your great answers. Someone should hire you as a writer for these Sleeve sites. When you explains it - everything make sense. "but I was a volume eater. It was nothing for me to eat an entire large pizza by myself." When you descibe this, I become aware, that I am a volume eater too. Regarding everything.Every food. Especially when it is "free" or "most for you money in the buffet" kind of things. Embarrasing, but thats how it is/was. And recognizing, that I am volume eater too, make me even more sure, that this is the operation for me. Now, I hate it if I take one too many bites. If I could have that feeling, I would be halfway there. "Gastrectomies have been performed decades upon decades for people with ulcerative conditions, or stomach cancer. I researched gastrectomies outside of weight loss surgery, and found 1000s of people...." That make me feel so secure. I am glad you have reserched so much - it has been difficult for me to find all the medical journals, statistics and material. I am sure, that this is the most healthy operation to choose - BUT still 10% afraid, that I will not loose kore than 10 pounds. But if I work with this, put a lot of effort in it, visiting dieticians ect. It can not go totally wrong. :-) I am much more likely to succed. And I am sure, when I have read all the succes stories here - I will believe, that it could happen to me. "The VSG has studies out for 5+ years showing great success as long as the surgeon uses a small bougie" I am so glad, you told me this, exlained the word to me. Now, I will ask the surgeons about this too. If you have the time and energy - What will happen if they use something bigger? More tissue damage, or complications or? If they don't remove the organ, there is no "ectomy" performed. Now I understand - and the remain of the stomach is the least strechy part. Intelligent :-) And can not se, how they will get the rest of the stomach outc - but thats perhaps what the bougie is for. Investigation.... I could give you the laundry list of complications and weight regain stats for all my "real life" friends that have had RNY, but it would take me forever. I won't deny that RNY is a good surgery for some, but the stats were just too alarming for me to choose that procedure. There is not that much focus here in Denmark on these complications - but mayby there will in a few years. The bypass have boomed the last 3 years. I dont know how much help other countries get post operation. But In Denmark the healtcare system is free - I would imagine, that you will get your helth checked much more, when doctors, hospitals, test ect is free. pouches suck - got it - thats what a lot of people experience. :-( If they are talking about hiatal hernias, they are common in obese patients and usually repaired during surgery. I tried to find the medical term in english, but could not. Hernia is a lot of things - what I mean is, when the small instestines are twisted, or go through the incistion holes. A lot of people have problems after surgert with these kind of hernias/twisted intestines - and its lethal/mortal. But as far as I can se, this is more common for bypassers than for sleeve-patiens? Since you are in Denmark, I would highly suggest talking to your surgeon about being prescribed an acid reducer. This helps protect your staple line, and can help decrease false hunger caused by acid reflux that sometimes occurs post-sleeve. I am so glad you told me this! here is nothing about this on the different websites. I will keep all the ino, you have given me, and ask my surgeon. Interesting, that acid kan promote some kind of fake hunger. That is fantastic, that this can help so much. . Thank you so much Tiffany! I leaned so much new Hugs from Copenhagen

Dear Shannon Thank you so much for sharing your story! Lots of hugs from Copenhagen

I haven't been operated yet. Told my family, 3-4 of my friends, my bosses and some co-workers. Now I would rather have told just my family. Maybe I am a little paranoid - but the person, I tell will probably tell it to some people too. It is good gossip, and I think it is so difficult to be secret about it. I have already think, that I have told too many. Cant take it back. Most people have seen me try too loose weight for 15 years now. But I am such an optimitic person, and want to share. Cant keep my mouth shut - and also want people to understand, that overweight is not easily battled. Telling them about the statistics - want to speak about this subject. On the other hand, I dont want to walk in to a party, and everybody is talking about the sleeve-girl - me. The label just stick - and I want to be known for who I am, not my operation. In Denmark this is HUGE On the other hand, I feel a little like a quitter. I have a danish website about embracing your body as it is. I have also been a plussize-model. Now I suddenly turn my back on my overweight gals. I will not do this to promote the skinny stupid Milan-fashion ideas about skinny bodies. I will do it for my health. :-) And deep down inside of me, I would like to be in the normal BMI-group. Dont tell anyone!

I like to read that kind of statistics - it makes me sure, that an operation is right for me. 10% off will not make me healthy Thanks

YEAH! I got more answers - I am so gratefull All your inputs really helps me! In Denmark this procedure is almost unknown - it is only used very seldom. Most of sleeve-procedures on danes is done abroad Thank you for your respond, Tiffany! "RNY just wasn't an option because of the regain stats" The statistics shows that weight regain RNY is more likely to happen? That is very interesting - if I have understood it correct? That was the main reason why, I would consider a Bypass. I know that there is a lot complications already now. How will it look in 30 years? :-( "I can tell you that studies show only 30% of RNY patients "dump" on sugar meaning that it's no guarantee that you'll get sick if you eat sweets." That is an important argument for not believing, that this will "cure" your cravings. So it is not as beneficial in this way - only the malabsorbtion works "better". But unfortunately also on important Vitamins and minerals. "and all of them have either gained back 75% of their weight" WHAT? Thats a lot!!! The surgery sites claims, that only 20-30% will have the weight regain. "and are now seeking revisions, or have had major complications with vitamin/nutrient deficiencies, bowel obstructions, strictures, pouch and esophageal dilation, and a whole slew of other issues." That really helps with my decision. I think that we perhaps are not so up to date in Denmark, because the boom in operations startet only 2 years ago. So we havent seen all the difficulties yet. Well a lot of people is writing about Hernia - does anyone know, if hernia is less common in VSG-operations? "Least amount of long term complications" As far as I can read in the journals, they do not have enough results yet to know how it will work on long term? But it is so LOGICAL to me that it will have far less complications "no rerouting" Yes, I am not religious - but it is easier for me to have my stomach reduced instead of changing the way the digestive system works. I can better accept the "halfway-just-as-before-procedure-with-a-small-stomach" "no blind stomach left behind that can't be easily scoped yet can still develop cancer and ulcers." Are the taking the rest of the stomach out of the body in a VSG? Some say that they just staple it? I wanted to ask my surgeon this. If it is left in the body, will it still produce Ghrelin? I feel a little stupid, but I have treally tried to find as many informations - so I am so glad, I found this site. "None of the surgeries cure cravings, head hunger, or emotional eating." No, you need to have gotten the brain in order first. I almost have - but I know, that when I am stressed or sad, it could trick this, if I am not cafeful and monitor my feelings and hunger for the rest of my life. But I have worked with this a lot more than others. (I am also writing these things to myself, to be "aware" - thinking out loud) "I've done extremely well with the sleeve, and live a perfectly normal little life" I am so glad to hear that! It really makes me believe that it can help me too. Just enough to get into the healthy section "We have to form new habits, and work on our own issues." I am speculating - how many have had their cognitive emotional in check before an operation - and how many are working along with the issues - after the operation. THANK YOU SO MUCH! ------------------------------------------------------------- And thank you Stacy160 - if you are thinking the same as Tiffany, it just backs up, what she is saying . And with my "low" BMI, the risk of bypass is not worth it. As far as I have read, the mortality-risk of a bypass is 5 times higher than a sleeve. Thank you. You are backing me up! ------------------------------------------------------------------ Thank you for your message, Cheri :-) "if you don't have as much weight to lose, why risk the lifelong nutritional deficiencies of the bypass?" That is just what I am thinking. But in the danish forum everyone is supporting the bypass-thinking Because it is the thing, that works. And because 95% of them had that operation. So I needed to read other stories, to make my desicion. But a lot of new reseach has shown, that the two operation, have almost the same results. But I can not seem to find the medical documentation... "The portion of the stomach they leave behind is the least stretchy part of the stomach and is far less likely to stretch than the bypass pouch. It will stretch a little over time, but not anywhere near what it was prior to surgery." That I didnt know - I am so glad to read this! That calms me a lot. Not that I will try to strech it. But I didnt wanted to waste money and health on an operation, that didnt work much. "If you wouldn't mind posting information about your potential surgeons on a new thread, it would be very helpful to some of us living overseas. I'm currently in Germany and flew all the way to Mexico for my surgery because I couldn't find a surgeon very experienced with VSG in my area. If you're in contact with a few that do VSG in Europe, you should post their names and information so that other folks can have them as an option as well." Mexico is a long way from home.... I would be happy to do that. I found two surgeons i Belgium, but they mostly recommend and perform Bypass, but have experience in Sleeve as well. There is also a center in Northern Germany wch are very popular in Denmark, they perform a lot of sleeve operations as well. And I found a great (I think) surgeon in Grecce. He is educated i Denmark, where I am from, and have worked in Sweden for many years. There is also a center in Stockholm, who have a fantastic 3 year follow up with psychologist, dieticians, hotline, and a workshop - all included in the price. But I will try to find the right place to post the operation. But what is "Experienced"? How many operations is that. Thank you Cheri

Thank you so much for answeing, Eurika C! You are right, that decision is difficult. Hearing from other, who have had the surgery - og could give some kind of input. I have trying to read a lot in here, and will probably read all, every thread, before I dicide. "1. I am a person who likes to eat large amounts. I think the restriction will be the most important tool for me. " I hope it is ok for me to ask you these. Large amounts of intake is no longer possible, so it will give you some kind of resticted intake. Do you think, that your urge to eat is so strong, that over time, you could stretching the stomach? And you could digest larger amount over time? What I am thinking about is, that no matter how strong ones feeling of succes is. It is difficult to know, if the old habits will get control over one again. I personally think, that I will do all there is to do, to keep a healthy lifestyle. I have been looking into and working with all the emotions eating is giving me. Mayby the ghrelin reduction will handle some of the appetite "2. I am concerned about the malabsorption of the RNY. I have a brother in law who has done very well so far on the RNY, but I am still concerned. It is important to me to eat as close to a varied normal diet as possible once I have healed and reach maintenance levels." That is also how I feel. What will happen in 20 years from now. It seems logical, that the long time Vitamin and mineral difficiency must be less with a sleeve operation. That is pointing me in the sleeve direction :-) "As for the sweets issue, people can sabotage their surgery by eating high calorie slider foods." Excactly - and how much is too much? I would do anything, but I also more and more see this urge to art like an addiction. Like alcoholism. I know, I need to take care of it every day I have read that 2/3 of the people who have batriatic procedure is have some kind binge eating disorder. " Is this something you are willing to take ownership of and combat? " Yes - ownership is a good word. I need to struggle with after an operation - but I hope the struggle with get just a little easier in some ways. "The sleeve is a tool, and you have to work the tool by following the post surgery guidelines." Yes, and that tool could be so helpful - mayby I am to optimistic, but I see it as I am half way there with this helpertool of mine. THANK YOU AGAIN!

Cant help to think that my sleep apnea keeps me in a visious circle. Less sleep = more ghrelin = more appetite = increased weight . My conclusion is, that it could be more difficult to loose weight the natural way, when you are obese and have sleep apnea. I wake up 50 times a noight - I am sure, that will disturb the grelin secretion as well.. (Not operated yet)

Interesting - thank you! I haven't had my surgery yet, but I DO have memory problems. Probably related to a earlier stress brake down. Just a 5% improvement would really help my everyday life. So this is one more pro's on having the surgery done. Thank you for sharing