Vicki J

I went through SSF Kaiser and they had the 5 hour orientation. It really revolved around mostly bypass with a little band peppered in. I think it may have evened out more by now because they are more knowledgeable about the band now. Basically, they weighed you, measured you (height), gave you a binder full of information, introduced you to the team of people you would be getting to know through the process and talked about mindful eating and how to eat post-op. Each person on the "team" gave their own little portion of the presentation. They also put you on a "pre-op meal plan". We weren't supposed to call it a diet because "it is a new way of life". LOL Pretty long and drawn out but it wasn't too bad.

Watch out the smoking police will come and take your band back!!!!! Just kidding. Yeah, I smoke about a pack a week. I went to my doctor who said that this wasn't considered a habit just a bad choice. He said that they didn't have anything that they could treat my small problem with because it would all make me sick. I did quit before my surgery for about a month and didn't smoke again for about 2 months after surgery. You'd think I would have just stayed away from them. Well, I guess if I had to give up one crutch when I'm stressed, food was the choice with the band. Now I've lost the weight and I'm on maintenance. Maybe my New Year's resolution will be the smoking. Good luck. It is far better to be one of the people who have responded to this. Hopefully someday I'll join that group too.

No liquid diet prior and liquids for only about a week to a week and a half after. Then it's on to mushies for about a week and then solids added at your comfort. As a matter of fact, you can go out and have dinner the night before surgery as long as it's befor 5 or 6. No drinking after midnight.

Hey no worries. I asked a lot of questions, too. The pre-op diet was basically a 1200 calorie diet. They had you eating approximately 3 - 4 oz of Protein, a bread at at least two of the meals, approximately 6 cups of veggies, a milk at two of the meals and a fruit at two of the meals. They said that if you had more than 4 hours between meals that you should add a snack of one protein and one fruit. It was really quite a bit of food. Oh and they had you eating 2 - 3 fats also. As far as the post op diet went, I was on fluids (clear) for only a day or two. When you leave the hospital they have you on full fluids. I think that lasted for a week and then you went to a week of mushies. Usually you have seen the surgeon by this time and he usually graduates you to regular food shortly after that. My surgeon was on vacation so he gave me a schedule to go to regular foods prior to seeing him. When do you go to orientation?

Sarah - I totally agree with you. It's sad that trying to find a way to help as well as commensorate with someone is automatically thought of as being against someone. I'm with you and I want Tom to be a wild success at this. Sometimes understanding how a doctor thinks helps to communicate with the doctor. Tom - Weigh and measure all of your food, journal EVERYTHING, and keep track of your weight loss regularly. Eat banster size meals (3 oz lean Protein, .5 - 1 C of produce and maybe a snack of fruit or multigrain products) THIS IS NOT BECAUSE I THINK YOU'RE MESSING UP! This is because if you take all this information into your doctor you will give her a good picture of what is going on. Also, add into your journal where you're eating, how you're eating and how long that meal lasts. If you are hungry and can't survive on bandster portions, fill up on veggies. These need to be veggies without fats added. Arm yourself with facts when you go and see your doctor. Keep in mind that it takes a while for us to Iron out what we're doing and why. For the first time in over a year I finally realized I am so bored with food. Eating now is not a reason for waking up but it is for nourishment. Finally I feel like I have broken free of my dependence on it for solving my problems, keeping me company, etc. It sure feels good to have escaped the chains that bound me for so long. You will get here too. I can't say when because we are all individuals. But you will get here.

Oh, yeah that is a Marathon. LOL I started with orientation 6/5/07 and had surgery on 12/12/07. I had surgery about 2 months ahead of time because of a cancellation. It sounds like some people are taking longer and some are getting through it quicker now. I wonder what makes the difference. My advice to anyone who is going through the process is once they get through orientation that they should start calling for cancellations. The only "cancellation list" that they have is for surgery. They do not call and try to fill cancellations for any of the other appointments and they are left open until someone calls and checks for them. Also, loose the weight as quick as possible. After that make sure to maintain or continue to loose. They are sticklers about people who want to fight the system. I was told that they have people knocking down the door to have surgery and they don't have to "bend" the rules for someone who doesn't want to work the program. They also consider this surgery "elective". I continued to loose because I knew it would put me that much closer to goal when I finally got the band. Hope that helps!

What Kaiser Marathon? I went through the SSF program and I am at maintenance.

There are many reasons why doctors only give you certain amounts in your fill but they all go to the same result and that is no complications if possible. You have lost 10 pounds in 2 months and that is right on the mark for the recommended weight loss. The recommended weight loss is 1 - 2 pounds per week AVERAGE. This is one of the reasons your doctor is not taking your stress as an emergency. One of the things that happened to me was that I was continuing my pre-op diet after my surgery so I would continue to loose weight while I waited for my "sweet spot". My doctor was reluctent to give me a fill until I explained what I was doing. He was going by my weight loss not my hunger/volume. After that he was more willing to adjust me if I said I needed an adjustment. However, he gave me 1 cc on the first fill and .5 cc on the following fills. You should loose 1 - 2 pounds average per week, be able to get by on 3 oz of protein, 1/2 to 1 cup of produce, and maybe a fruit or multigrain snack. If you're not measuring your food and you're just eating until you're "full", you won't know what to tell him. Also, your calorie intake should be >1200 per day. You should also stay full for 3 - 4 hours in between meals. We have to work on our head issues also. The band is a subtle thing and it's very easy to miss the signals. It's also very fickle and there were instances where I left the doctor's office thinking that I didn't feel any change and 2 weeks later I was wondering if I was going to be too tight. Our bodies flexuate and so does our tightness. Because the doctor can't be at our sides he has to do what is right for the majority and work it until it fits us as individuals. Restriction is not a strangle hold on your stomach. It is a sensation of contentment. Trust me, it will come to you. This is not a method of weight loss that is fast but it is a VERY healthy one. You can control your weight loss by exercising the bandster rules and contolling your calories. I am not saying you're eating junk, but if you journal you might find somethings that were overlooked that you can adjust. Take care and realize that the doctors are not trying to harass you. They are really trying to ease you up to your sweet spot so that you don't have complications. They also have hundreds of patients who need his attention just as much as you do. Vicki

Do the same thing you did to loose the 79 lbs.! Obviously you have the drive to be able to do this. I understand how discouraging this gets when you don't have the right restriction. Veggies (not loaded with fats) are a great way to fill up the needed bulk. Be careful though because they can be hard to digest if you're a newbie and they are raw. I know I get where I pout a lot because even with restriction I enjoy my food so much I want to be able to eat more. Of course, I've gotten where I tell myself that I can have more...LATER! As far as cooking goes, I eat out more than I eat at home. I realize that I have to be careful because of hidden calories and I look up what I'm going to have online and journal it. I'd be lost without fitday. Cooking is the best way to go but a calorie is a calorie and keeping it under 1200 is the key. Since banding and the right adjustments I usually stayed under 1000 to give myself the extra "hidden" calories. Now I'm trying to adjust my eating to maintain. It scares me to give myself permission to "add" calories. LOL Instead of chicken breast and Beans how about chicken breast and a veggie like squash or brocoli? You can eat a whole lot more of some veggies than others and beans have a lot of carbs in them. Carbs can be good but carbs can also make you feel hungry sooner. The carbs in some veggies are less in both the amount and how soon they make you hungry. This is why Chineese food doesn't keep you full longer. (I still love it). Never go more than 4 hours between Breakfast, lunch or dinner. At my work I have a 5 hour lapse in between breakfast and lunch so I incorporate a snack of 1 Protein and a fruit or bread. So I might have a piece of string cheese and an apple or some crackers. The final thing that you need to do is go over in your mind what's been said in the appointments. I discovered that my doctor had a hard time justifying a fill because I was loosing everytime I went in. I kept telling him I was hungry and he was afraid I was trying to make the band do all the work. When I found out what was the problem I let him know that I was restricting myself to 1200 and excercising 3x per week and "Of course I would loose." I had already lost over 70 pounds that way waiting for surgery on their pre-op diet. I told him that I was in this to loose weight and so I had every intention to continue as I had pre-op. The light bulb went on and he started giving me fills when I said I thought I needed them. He couldn't believe when I cancelled my last appt for a fill because I told him I was ok with where I was. So you have to make sure that the doctor is understanding your message. I took in my food journal to show them what I was eating, I wrote down when I got hungry and how much I had eaten. You have to give them the whole picture. I also sometimes found that what I thought I had eaten may not have been enough or may have been eaten with too much time in between the last meal. Our minds do play with us. You can do this and with some work on your doctor's part and your part you can make it a workable relationship.

Subtle persuasion is the key my friend. Glad things worked out on the orientation. You'd think they would try to fill the empty slots but they only do that for the actual surgery.

Has anyone thought that maybe this doctor is trying to see if Tom is willing to work with the band or that maybe they're trying to point out that the band is a tool? The doctor might also be worried that if they tighten the band too much with this lack of control that Tom might be in immense danger of really hurting himself. I know that sneaking up on the sweet spot is a pain but there is a reason for it. Kaiser had us loose 10% of our overall weight not only to shrink our livers but to show them that we could commit ourselves to this lifestyle. Sorry to sound so harsh but it's hard work to do this and it's time to re-evaluate why you did this. Vicki

Trompuda - Call patient services or the bariactric department and ask them if they cover it. You can also go to your HR and get a copy of your insurance coverage. These two steps will not only give you something to do but will answer it completely. To my knowledge unless you have something drastically wrong (which you should know) they don't stop you from WLS. I do know that if they find things like the high ferritin reading they found with me, that they will investigate it prior to continuing. I'm glad they do this because they want us to succeed. It takes so long to get through the program because as mentioned above they want to make sure you're educated and physically capible of going through it. Also, they are so bombarded with people like us wanting WLS and they only have a few surgeons doing it. Lastly, this surgery is viewed as elective. Good luck with your journey.

You will be amazed at how quickly the time flies during that 6 months. Then you get the call that they are scheduling you for surgery and everything goes into high gear.

Call the bariactrics department. Our bariactric department in So. San Francisco said that the psych appointment needed to be with THEIR psychiatrist. They wouldn't let us do it closer to home. I'm not sure about the nutritionialist either. So my suggestion is to either wait until orientation or to call bariactrics. There is no reason to do all of this and then have to do it over again. Keep in mind that ALL the Kaisers have their own little methods of operation. So this may be ok with your's. Just check before you do too much more. Vicki

Boopie - Congratulations! Great follow through. I know I had the same problem trying to find out if they did LB surgery last year. You think it would be easier to find out. It's also good that they are doing the sleeve. Anything is better than GB in MHO. I still would have gone with the band because it worked just as well as my GF sleeve surgery. I like that all my insides are the same. Again congratulations and good luck!!! Keep us posted. Vicki

Gina - Have you thought about getting a TENS machine? You can buy them online and they are for pain relief. I have a friend who has had back surgery and also suffers from bouts of pain. She uses one all the time. I have one I use for my arthritus. Vicki

Karri68 - I know that it's frustrating having to deal with micro-fills but I'm sure he's trying to make sure you don't have any problems with your band. My surgeon was very conservative after the first fill and I too was very frustrated. I had to drive 3 hours each way and usually take a whole day off of work to get these fills. I am, however, happy now that he did it that way because he nailed my sweet spot and I have never had any PBing or slimming. I've never even been really stuck. Talk to him about your frustration. I also had to learn how to word what I was trying to say because my doctor was not understanding what I was trying to communicate. He would see that I was loosing weight at a good rate and I was telling him I was hungry. Most of his "hungry" patients were eating to appease that hunger. I had to point out to him that he couldn't go by weight loss because I was still working the 1200 calorie diet and exercising and OF COURSE I would loose weight. Armed with that information he changed what he was doing and listened to when I told him I felt I needed a fill. They get a small amount of time with you and have to deal with many different personalities so they have to kind of see everything in a condensed version. They, unfortunately, also get all of those who think the band will do it all. So it's a fine balance. Of course, there's always the jerk surgeon thrown in there too but I like to think they are rare. :smile2: Hang in there. Your sweet spot is in your future. I know this is a frustratingly slow process but once you get there you'll be off and running. Vicki

I had surgery 6 months after my orientation on June 6, 2007. My advice for you is to first get online and check for appointments on your Kaiser page. The only one that won't show up is the phsych appt. I didn't check to see if my actual surgery date showed up but they called me and trust me I didn't forget. LOL - That way you won't miss any appointments because of someone else's error. The second thing I would suggest is to be aware of what appointments you're supposed to have. You can then call on a regular basis and ask if they've had cancellations. They don't call people to try and fill those (except for surgery) so frequently they have them available. This should help you move along a little faster. Don't be rough on them, they are very overwhelmed. Loose the weight required NOW. They really like to work with people who get the job done because it demonstrates to them that you are willing to follow the program. As you have probably read on different pages, there is a vast difference in what doctors want from their patients. Kaisers attitude is "We don't have to work with the people who don't want to follow the program because we have so many people who are beating down our doors that are willing to follow it." Yeah, that's a quote. Other than that, remind yourself of how much you're saving by having insurance. There are so many people out there that aren't as lucky as we are. It's a pain to have to wait but it's worth it in the end. PM me if you have any questions I can answer or just ask on the forum and there are several people who can help you. Good luck on your journey. Vicki

To those of you just starting out, use the phrase "just because I can doesn't mean I should". Just because you can eat a lot or eat something you were told you shouldn't doesn't mean that you should eat it. You can still practice eating like a bandster and begin loosing weight now. It's harder, I'll give you that but it does put you that much farther ahead of the game. I couldn't say what dimmed my desire for junk food. The band dims the desire to eat between meals and I think that just weaning myself from the sweets made it where my body adjusted to wanting the good stuff. No, I'm not perfect. I don't want to be. However, when you can only eat a small amount you learn what works the best. Dense Protein keeps you full faster without having to cut the circulation off in your stomach. :thumbup: Carbs don't last a long time and you'll be hungry sooner. Absolutely do whatever your doctor says. I don't know why they are all different but they are. It's always good to error on the side of healing. I wasn't hungry for about 2 weeks after surgery. Just goes to show you how different we all are. Heartfire - good to see you're doing well. Vicki

Call the bariactric department or patient services and ask if they do the band. They should also tell you how to go about the proceedure for getting in the program. That's what I did up here in No. Cal.

I live with my band a little looser than most people. I do this because of the fickleness of the band. It does get tighter at certain times. Sometimes you can't figure out why. I also don't want to have to worry if I don't chew things to mush or eat a little faster. I still have my limits but I just don't want to have to stress out about each bite or what I eat. I also found that restriction doesn't mean a throttle hold on my stomach. When I had this light bulb moment I stopped looking for it. I get satisfied now with a bandster amount. Sometimes I have to sit there and let my spoiled little girl inside quite down and realize I'm done. I love the taste of food and the hardest problem I have is telling myself that I need to take the rest home and enjoy it later. LOL Being where I am has made it so I can enjoy almost anything I want but allows me the dimming of hunger to make the decission of what I want and not go on a rampage. It really takes the joy out of a good binge when you realize that you can only eat a little before you're full. It's kind of like laying on the floor kicking only one foot. Not very impressive and a waste of time. :cursing: I would talk to him about not coming in if you don't need to. He probably does the "see you in 4-6 weeks" out of habit. Have a good talk with him and see what he says. Sounds like you're in a good spot for the time being. As another person on another sight says, "Ride it until the wheels fall off!" Vicki

Ok, now I'm frustrated. I just lost everything I typed. :cursing: April - I'm sorry that you had all the problems with Dr. Le. He is a funny sort. (Funny meaning peculiar sort of way not meaning humorous). He is one that you must direct with a gloved hand. Once he starts to communicate with the patient it seems to work better. This is a good example of different surgeons working better for different people. It's good to see you're back on track and at your sweet spot. You'll be kicking some serious butt now. :huh2: Gina - You need to learn not to be worried about the people who diss people on this or any forum. Also, check out smartbandsters.com. This is a group that was started by a bariactric nurse when she had the band placed 10 years ago and there was no support groups in the US. The band hadn't been approved up here yet so she went to Mexico to have the surgery. You will see lots of successes, a few strugglers, and a huge amount of support. Also, it's nice having some long timers and a professional to answer your questions. There are only 3 reasons for not loosing with the band. 1) medical reasons - thyroid, etc. 2) The placement of the band. 3) user error. This includes not having the right adjustment because it's up to the user to make sure they get to their sweet spot. Being too tight can lead to "soft food syndrome" which means that most people at this state are eating more calories then they think they are. You don't stay full on soft foods and a lot of people don't realize they are taking in so much. If you're too tight or too loose, you need to be a pain in the butt until they get you right. April did the right thing and went home to contact her surgeon and let him know what had happened at the ER and she got him to get her back on track. A lot of people just pout about it and don't take action. Sometimes it's a wait to get in. That's life. You need to get on your 1200 calorie diet and work REALLY hard until you get there or you need to accept that you won't loose weight while you're waiting. I chose the band because 1) I didn't want anyone rearranging my insides. The chance of leaks scared me. 2) I'm one of the world's worst pill takers. I forget. So taking supplements is not a good thing. 3) I wanted something that could be adjusted so that if I needed to have something different I could get it done. If I get where I'm hungry 3 years out, I want to be able to get tightened. If I have a reason to need less Fluid in there, I want to be able to do that too. I would have gone GB if that is all I could do but give me another choice and I would probably have taken that. With the band you can expect to loose between 4-8 pounds per month on AVERAGE. It sounds slow but it's healthy and when it's done it will seem like it wasn't that slow at all. All WLS end up about the same at 3 years. Choose what you're comfortable with. It is an individual thing. If you want to PM me, do so. However, don't be afraid of the people with bad attitudes. They simply aren't worth the worry. Vicki

luv2teech7 - Wow, you're doing great! 5 - 10 pounds per month puts you right in the expectation range. I know it seems slow right now but it will amaze you at how well you did when you look back on your journey. Keep going! As far as going to your surgeon goes, I know for the first 6 months they like to keep an eye on you. However, if you're past that point, I would be talking to your surgeon about only coming in if you need to. My surgeon cut me loose at around 4 months out. I came in the next month for one more fill but haven't been back since. I have his email if I have a question and I can make an appointment if I need one. Talk to him. Hopefully he'll be reasonable. Vicki

lachica39 - Wow what a great post! The insight into what's been going on was really something that you had to look deep inside yourself for. I'm sorry to hear about your Mom. Mine's been in and out of the hospital several times in the last couple of years but so far we've gotten her back on her feet each time <knock on wood>. It really makes things hard as far as thinking about yourself goes. But thankfully my band has done it's job and kept me on track. The reason you don't have problems with cupcakes is that they don't clump as much. Darn it! At least if something gives us problems we have to think about it. It looks like you have a great support team. That is so important. The fact that you're using them now and being honest with them and yourself will give you some great ammunition to be strong on this journey. I have to tell you how much I admire the soul searching you did and the fact that you acknowledged what was happening and formed a plan. That is such a hard thing to do. You're going to do great with the band just because you're problem solving instead of trying to place the blame for it not working. You will get back on track faster than you think and it will help you loose all the extra weight. Hopefully others who are having problems will read your post and be inspired to look at the whole truth of what's going on. This could be anything from eating the wrong foods to grazing to possibly being too tight or not tight enough. Like you they have to stop being afraid to fix the problem. Hats off to you and now we can watch you succeed in your journey. Vicki

Hey Gina - Never say never. I occassionally indulge in the forbidden fruit but after eating my good meal first. Usually because I don't want to have my band make me regret eating too much I only eat a taste and surprisingly I'm totally happy with that. So just make sure that when you want your taste to take someone who will finish it or that you're comfortable walking away from it. DO NOT TAKE IT HOME! Taking home the good stuff is acceptable but not the treats. I am doing great with the band! I reached goal about 3 weeks ago and I'm learning to live in maintainance. So far so good <knocking on wood>. One of the things I would say is to try and think of how the surgeon is receiving what you're trying to say. (Clear as mud, huh) What I mean is I had decided to continue doing the 1200 calorie diet with exercise until I reached my sweet spot. During one of my visits he told me that he didn't want to give me a fill because I was loosing weight. After a brief but bloodless battle he gave me a SLIGHT fill. I went home pouting because I was still hungry. At that point I realized that he didn't have the whole picture. The next visit started out the same but changed when I informed him that he couldn't go by my loosing weight. I told him what I was doing and that I would loose weight because of that. With this information he gave me what was his normal fill of .5 cc. From that point on I tried to think out my approach to the appointments so that he could know what was going on and react to all the information. Other than that, living with the band for me has been easy. The worse thing that has happened to me is about a week ago I got ahold of some pork that was way too dry and it irritated my stoma for a few days. I spent that time trying to eat some soft foods/liquids and now everything is fine again. I have been really careful not to get too tight and throttle my stomach. Hunger isn't like it used to be and you really don't get that emergency feeling anymore once you get to the sweet spot. Of course, full isn't the same anymore either. You have to realize when you're satisfied rather than that "God I ate too much" feeling. It's a learning curve and you'll push it once in a while. Just try not to push too often and you'll be fine. I live by the rule that I can have anything I want. Ok, I hear all the hard core banders out there yelling "What!!!???" The other side of that is that I also journal and when I see that if I eat something high calorie that I'm going to be hungry for the rest of the day, it usually is enough for me to decide I don't want it. I give myself 1200 calories. A calorie is a calorie but some of them come with not enough bulk. During my weight loss phase I used to limit myself to 1000 except for days when I wanted that little extra. Be true to yourself. Your body is the most accurate calorie counter you can find. If you're burning more than you take in, you'll loose. Less, you'll gain. Don't look at this like it a punishment or you'll fail. This is the beginning of life for all of us. It feels so good to be on the skinny side. Good luck on your surgery. Feel free to contact me whenever you have a question. Test new foods carefully.