WASaBubbleButt

What? I know I've been around here for over a year, Beth that long too. How you choose to react to any given situation is in each individual's control. No one "makes" a person revert to his/her teen years. I know we all should get along and there's a nice way and a mean way to say things but honestly that is just BS. If you don't like it, don't read it. You're a grown up. Act like one. And it's berate not berade. Sorry to be petty but the person screaming on here the most seems to be you. We all try to "discuss the idea" and not the person. Facts are if you cheat post op it can hurt you. Sugar coating things isn't on most of our diet plans.

If you don't like my posts, don't read them. We all have that right, fortunately! There are posters I avoid; but I don't attack them either. I find your behavior as bad, or worse, than hers actually.

And she huffed and she puffed and she stormed out of here with the greatest of drama! ;o)

My thoughts EXACTLY Darce- it just surprise me how people who are screaming in for the first time -felt so GD entitled to berade the crap out of all of us who have been here supporting eachother since the beginning ! i am not disputing the vadility of their message and I think that there experience is a GOLDEN Opportunity to teach us--but there is a right way and the wrong way that is just gonna make most people revert to our teen years and let it go in one ear and out the other and that would be a DAMN shame, because I know what they are saying and trying to teach us is priceless !!!!

Beth- thanks for hearing my message and I look forward to your experience and post that will guide us that are just learning and making mistakes because we just dont know better right now !!

For others deciding to CHIME in now, I hope you remeber what the uncertainty and the emotions that you were going throug at the begining and have some thought before you jump in !!

With that said this is my last post on this thread since it is becoming a useless discussion and not helpful to those that really need the support !!!

All the vets here have done the post op diet. It is not something one forgets. I've done it twice. First one was two weeks of clears, 2 weeks of fulls, 2 weeks of soft foods. Next one was 10 day stages of the same.

Please do not assume we have somehow forgotten those times of our lives. Sometimes the truth just hurts, it's life. It's how it is.

I was warned to stick with obesityhelp.com by my surgeon and now I know why.

Heh... I have to laugh. I was just over at OH band boards (gasp!) and I was reminded of this thread. Just from last week.

Would you do it again? Everyone please answer

Yessssss, I can see why your surgeon suggests you post on OH. ;o)

The rest of your post explains my point for me. If you found nirvana with the Sleeve, then why are you even here? Go to the Sleeve board.

Why wouldn't I come here? I have spent more time banded than I have sleeved. I have a lot of information. There are a lot of struggling bandsters. Why wouldn't I offer what I know? There is also a section for band complications and band removal, why wouldn't I post there?

I think you have made it clear that you only want people posting that will validate your choice, tell only the upsides of surgery, and never dare tell the negative sides. It's not going to happen. That's not how message boards work.

People who are researching need all sides of the issue, they need to know the good and the bad before they can make a good decision. They need to read links, studies, talk to those that both like and dislike the band. That's called research.

If the person that backed out of the band to go with the Sleeve wanted validation and/or support than why would they not go to the Sleeve board? Maybe I'm missing something.

I thought the OPs post was a fantastic post! They were wanting info before jumping into something which is what a great many people do. If she was planning on a band but was unsure, why is it a horror for her (him? her?) to post on both boards? I think you are being quite unreasonable.

Generally, what I have been responding to here is the nature of the pro-sleeve posters that goes much farther than supporting the person but also engaging bandsters in superfluous and antagonous debate about research.

No, we disagree. When a person who claims to be a nurse is spreading around very incorrect medical and statistical information it needs to be corrected. People tend to put more stock into info posted by someone with a license relating to medicine vs. someone who does not. When that information is dead wrong and even the band makers are not making those claims, it needs to be pointed out and corrected.

The question I honestly have is why would a Sleevester feel the need to come and engage bandsters when you claim to be happy about your choice and respect the choices of others? The answer must be that you're looking for validation. If that is the case, then, I'm simply stating that this is the wrong place to look for it.

Because I don't like closed perspectives and closed worlds. I also post on a revision board, an RNY board, a general board, an "at goal" board, sleeve boards, all kinds of boards. I'm not one to stop learning and hide my head in the sand. I want to know everything related to WLS. Don't you? I'm not sure what I would need validation for. I'm healthy, I'm at goal, I'm maintaining a 20BMI well for over a year and a half, I can eat anything I want, I have no food restrictions, what is it specifically that you think I need validation? Please, be specific.

This has long since turned personal. I question the propriety of airing it here.

See above.

That is demonstrably not accurate. The research I have done says that the LapBand takes 45mins to 1 hr. (mine took about an hour) and RnY takes 2.5 hrs or so. And they charge accordingly. The difference in the nature of the surgery is why the get more. The point is that the surgical firm has NO axe to grind either way. They can make money either way.

My surgery was substantially less expensive than my sisters.

You may not understand how an OR works. The time the surgeon is actually in the OR working on a patient is about 30 minutes unless the surgeon is unskilled and a dolt. It takes time to put the patient to sleep, prep the patient, drape the patient, then the surgeon comes in and does surgery. He leaves, the anesthesiologist wakes up the patient and he's taken to recovery. The surgeon's job is about 30 minutes, the patient is in the OR for about 45-60 minutes.

I agree and don't feel comfortable about it, I just got to the point where it became so absurd for me to look for LapBand support on a board where many belittle bandsters and those that support the procedure. So I got frustrated (I'm A.D.D. and suffer from low frustration tolerance. - not an excuse just a reason)

I was warned to stick with obesityhelp.com by my surgeon and now I know why.

I apologize if anyone has been offended.

If you think OH is any different, you are in error. Message boards are what they are. Period. Posting stats and facts isn't belittling banded folks. It's called adult posting. What it does seem to be is threatening to you for some reason. You made the right decision for you, so what's your problem?

A lot of it depends on the doctor. Some doctors do what is in the best interest of their patients. Some do what is in the best interest of their wallets.

I know of a doc in Phoenix that used to do ALL the major procedures, DS, bypass, sleeves, and bands. He was really a skilled surgeon, very skilled. But he found more money in bands. He can turns bands into an assembly line and pump out many daily. It's a money maker and he's turned into a band factory. I know another doc in Phoenix this is not a skilled surgeon and he's become an ERNY factory.

If they offer ALL the major procedures they are far more likely to give you a balanced opinion.

Now Monkey, don't be mean. :thumbup:

But I have to wonder: With as often as I read this type of thing (cheating), are the patients that uninformed OR is it simply doing what one wants? OR are the surgeons not telling their patients what's going on? Very alarming how many don't seem to know (or care) what they should NOT be doing.

It does explain the rising slip stats.

BethfromVA, I hear you and the core of your advice is sound but I just wish you went about delivering your message in a more constructive way. Insults and accusations never get the job done and having had a weight problem all your life, which is why You got the band I hope you remeber that all those times you wer lectured and screamed at about your weight it didnt help you !!!

yes I understand that you're just trying to shock some sense into what potential harm she can cause and I hope that Patty realizes that she shouldnt do that, but we have created a very caring bonded community here and while we would more than LOVE to have the expertise and experience that you bring, please...please remember that words can hurt very much and that what you respond to sometimes might not work for everyone and I can tell you that in our community here it wont work and hope you can respect that just like in the respectful manner that I am communicating to you.

Sometimes a little tough love is in order. One can pat the head of a noob and tell them anything they want to do is just peachy or they can give them a dose of reality.

We may not like hearing what we have done is wrong, but it's a necessary step in getting through the weight loss journey.

What Beth wrote is correct, it is her choice in delivery methods. You pick your delivery method and let others pick theirs. Fair?

Hi Linda99,

There have been a lot of kidnappings and killings going on in Mexico so that would be my first concern. It's not a safe place to be. You might want to check out the travel advisories on the State Dept website to see if the area you are considering going to is affected. You can also search the internet for info to. I do know that my husband and I have both been banned from going there by our employers due to the dangerous situation.

Good luck in your band journey.

The US and MX warnings are not for the entire country of Mexico, just a few select cities. Avoid Tijuana and Juarez, other than that cities are just like they are here.

I thought it was obvious since they make more money with the RnY that it would be a point of candor to admit that that the LB was working as well. Thus, it would make no sense not to believe them.

Lastly, and perhaps most importantly, you've obviously done a lot of research, but after reading all of your posts I get the general sense, with all due respect, that blosmtx and others are persons looking for validation for a decision already made rather than using the research in more objective fashion to find a knowable fact. In business, salesman are taught that people ALWAYS make a purchase decision with their right brain. They like to read through facts and figures, but ultimately decide with their gut. (no pun intended)

But that's fine, do what you feel is right. No one here will stop you or judge you.

But it is naive to the extreme to think you would not get a little push back from recent bandsters when you are, in effect, flaming a Lap Band board.

If you want validation, go over to the Sleeve board for heaven's sake.

I need validation for what I have done so I'm staying here on the LapBand board. I'm not going over to the Sleeve board to look for validation in NOT getting a Sleeve. Thanks for nothing blosmtx.

Now that I look back on this entire thread, it all seems so absurd for it to even be on this board.

But no, you have to come over here to the frickin' LapBandTalk board, to research us bandsters into a fit of maniacal depression. Great, I've got a gun to my head now. Are you frickin' happy?

Thanks for nothing WASaBubbleButt. I guess now you're just a hard @$$. (couldn't help it)

With all due respect and no offense intended. If any offense has been taken I reserve the right to revise and extend my remarks.

Quite frankly I don't have the slightest idea what you are talking about. I don't know what a push back is. I do not understand what your problem is with blosmtx.

Why is it that bandsters confusing "flaming" with "stats and facts"? Why is that threatening? If you have done your research and you chose the right surgery type for you why is it a threat when the same research you read pre op is presented for noobs?

What makes you think that doctors make more money with bypass than banding? They can do one bypass in 2.5 hours or they can do 5 bands in 2.5 hours. Hello? How does this make more money for them? With bands doctors have business for life in aftercare. With bypass people typically go to their PCP for follow up labs.

I have had a band and a sleeve. The band was not for me, the sleeve is great FOR ME. I wish I had the US long term studies on bands and sleeves when I was banded, I didn't have that honor because they did not exist at that time. Both just came out last year. I want others to have ALL the facts and not the feel good, "bands are safer than anything in the whole wide world," line of crap that simply is not true.

It seems to me that you are only wanting positives and not neutrality on this board. I ask you, is that fair to those researching their surgery choice? It also seems to me that you are putting your desire for validation in your surgery choice over noobs doing their research. How is that right?

And finally, I am not responsible for your choice in surgery types, I am not responsible for your mood. I am not responsible for validating your surgery options. Don't even try to blame me. You are responsible for those things, 100%.

Had my first visit with the surgeon today and he advised me and my husband to go with gastric bypass despite the fact that we had already decided to go with the band. He said we would lose more weight with bypass and that the lap band was like using a tiny hammer to hit a big problem, it doesn't make much of a difference.

I had decided long ago never to get bypass because I've heard of so many people who got sick after bypass. I've looked at before and after photos and almost all of them just look sick to me. The doctor ultimately said it was my body and the decision was mine but he basically tried to convince me that most people do very well, most dont get sick, and the risks and complications are minimal. He also said that the proceedures doctors use have evolved and improved over even just over the last 5 years and it's much better now.

Now I'm all confused, frustrated, and upset because I don't know what to do. I don't want to cut my insides all up and not be able to reverse it if I get sick. I know of people who have been on their death beds off and on since they had bypass, and some who have died. I haven't heard of a lot of this with the band and all the before/after photos people look healthier after. But insurance will pay for all but maybe $500 for bypass but it will not cover over $5000 for the band. When you put me and my husband together that's $10,000 spent on bands and we don't have that kind of money so we're talking a lot of debt. $10,000 versus $1,000... amazing what an extra zero will do.

So confused. :sad: :confused:

I wouldn't get either, I'd get the sleeve. To spend $10K on bands knowing what I know today... there is no way.

Maybe read this:

Medical News: ASMBS: Gastric Banding Less Effective than Other Procedures - in Meeting Coverage, ASMBS from MedPage Today

This is a big decision, do what is right for you.

Nurse09:

You have posted many times that the band is the safest and most effective WLS on the market today. I asked you to provide proof of this. I know you are reading, you were reading this very thread yesterday morning. So are you still looking for peer reviewed studies that show you are correct?

I asked you to prove your own claims. Where's the proof?

I also asked you to defend your claim that the sleeve has been proven to be ineffective although it's the fastest growing surgery today. Where is that proof?

Instead of providing proof to back up your claims you just disappear. Why is that?

Yes, I hold you to higher standards than I would others. You claim to be a nurse, your profile shows you wearing your cap. People put more stock into a medical professional and when you post sheer nonsense I am going to call you on it each and every time. If you are a professional (and since you are a nurse I certainly hope you are professional) you will either admit you posted incorrect information due to human error or you will post your proof. That just isn't asking too much.

You have lectured me time and time again on what I need to do to lose weight. I have lost 132#. I am at goal, I have a BMI of 20. I have maintained this for 1.5 years. In another post you wrote that you have lost 59# in 16 months. What's the deal here? You keep telling me that I need to follow my doctors instructions. You tell me, who followed their doctors instructions? You or me?

Cheers.

The problem with this study is that it is looking at five years back (starting in '03 or '04). For the gastric band and banding follow-up care and protocol development that was light years ago. The APS and APL were introduced in '07.

Many elements of the pre and post care are now designed specifically to reduce complications.

This is a common flaw when looking at studies, whether independent, peer-reviewed, or not.

Again, after what happened to my sister and brother where much of the weight has come back, it is a complete myth that RnY and/or Sleeve cannot be defeated. I know this from flat-out first hand experience.

First of all I never claimed one could not regain with bypass or the sleeve. What I disputed was the claim that the band is safest and the most effective WLS type out there. It is not.

You are absolutely right, there are no long term studies with the new band. Lots of big claims but nothing to back up those claims. We won't know about the latest version of band for years to come. Today people are guinea pigs, just like I was for the smaller band.

Did you know that many doctors in Canada are going back to the 4cc bands because people are not losing well with the mega bands?

First it was the mesh band, that didn't work. Then the non adjustable band, that didn't work. Then the small adjustable band, nothing changed really. Now the mega adjustable band. I don't know, from reading revision boards I'm not seeing where the fewer slips and erosion promises are panning out.

How can a band maker make a band that causes fewer erosions when it *still* a total unknown what causes erosion? Personally I don't think it is the band, I think it is something in the operating room. So how can you fix erosion when you have no idea what causes it? Yet the new bands make these claims.

The new bands had gazillions of dollars in advertising and big promises that there is no way the band manufacturers can fill.

One other point, when I was determining which surgical firm I would use, I talked to a group out of Northern Va and Maryland that has performed around 3000 Lap Bands and thousands and thousands of RnY also.

They said they have tweaked their care to the point where there is now no substantial statistical difference between APS/APL and RnY at the 3 to 4 year mark. The RnY lost quicker initially but bounced back up as the more steady trajectory of the Adjustable band was clearly more healthy.

The key is the follow-up care and teaching people how to use whatever tool they have.

I'd have to see how they go about tracking their numbers before blindly believing any doctor's claims. I've been watching doctors make big claims for 25 years now. I'd have to see the details before I'd believe them.

Nurse09:

Ok.

I haven’t followed this thread much, but a couple of things caught my eye.

Thus, I have a few …uh…..”observations”.

Nurse09 said:

“You are right education is a good thing so maybe you should research a little bit more”

Uh….Pardon me, Nursy, but there is virtually NO ONE on this ENTIRE forum that researches MORE and more completely than WasaBubbleButt. She researches this stuff more in a week than the vast majority of people do during their ENTIRE pre-surgery investigation. And it’s HIGH-QUALITY research as well. She doesn’t just read the backs of cereal boxes to get her information, the way it seems MOST people do who are “researching” the band. She KNOWS her stuff, both from experience, AND from detailed and meticulous research.

And based on a couple of things I have read from YOU, you should probably be prohibited by law from even USING the word “research”.

“The lapband is the safest and most effective bariatric surgery on the market today.”

Baloney. (note: what I REALLY mean is Bullsh**t, but I’m trying to be polite…)

THAT kind of statement is INCORRECT at its BEST, and HIGHLY IRRESPONSIBLE at it’s worst. It’s the kind of comment that leads people to making a decision that could be VERY WRONG for their particular circumstances, leading them to either NO weight loss, or the expense and physical trauma of a Revision Surgery.

It MAY be the “best” for some people. Of Course it is. ALL of the surgeries are “Best” for SOMEONE. But to characterize ANY ONE of them as “the best” for EVERYONE suggests that you have done NO research at all.

Different Surgeries. Different People. Different Bodies. Different Eating Disorders….etc.etc.. Understand that?

There is NO one-size-fits-all Weight Loss Surgery. Several overlap to a certain degree, but NOTHING is “The Best”.

Safest? Again, Wasa is correct.

Nurse09 said:

“so if i were to choose i would go with the lapband because at least you can reverse that one and not have as many complications with it”

Not as many complications as WHAT, exactly? There are a few things that can happen with ALL the WLS procedures, but “not as many”? c’mon, wake up. Erosion, Port Flipping, Port infection, band Slippage, pouch dilation, Leaks, Port twists/flips, Reflux, Stomal obstructions…..the list goes on, and it is getting somewhat LONGER as time goes on. Not to mention the simple fact that in some people, the body simply REJECTS a foreign object that is placed into the body. (please note: there are people on the forum whose body will not reject ANY foreign object that is placed into it, but that is a whole other thread…...)

One very important point that you do not seem to “get” is that with the Lap Band, it’s NOT as “reversible” as you might think. Sure, you can take it out. But by the time it has been determined that it NEEDS to be taken out, VERY OFTEN the damage has ALREADY BEEN DONE. This is the truest with erosion. And in SO many cases, when erosion is present, it PRECLUDES the possibility of ANY weight Loss Surgery being performed in the future. It’s not a simple matter of “oh well, it’s not working, let’s reverse it”. You can take it out, but very, very often, you CANNOT entirely repair the damage that it does. For SOME incidents of erosion, the ONLY way to repair the damage is by performing a Gastric Bypass. Ironic, eh?

So this notion of “reversibility” is not all that’s cracked up to be.

So, is ANY of this reason enough to NOT have the band?

NO. NOT AT ALL. The band WORKS MIRACLES for SOME PEOPLE. LOTS of people, actually, but to characterize it as the “best”, and to discount the very real possibility of a wide range of side effects and complications that are possible is simply foolish.

“If you look up the research you will see that the band is the most effective and safest over long term.”

Where do you get this crap? There IS no “the research”. There ARE no unbiased, peer-reviewed studies that have been done that are STATISICALLY SIGNIFICANT that lend ANY credence to ANYTHING you are saying. At all. There are lots of single/Surgeon single/facility studies that “suggest” outcomes one way or another, but the kind of studies YOU are suggesting do NOT exist in any statistically SIGNIFICANT form. I mean, the band has only been approved here for a little over 7 years. Add to THAT the fact that the procedure for installation has CHANGED a bit since approval, there are now several TYPES of bands on the market, and there are different variations among the bands, etc, etc, etc. There ARE NO “the studies”, and there will NOT be for a number of years to come.

Here’s one other piece of info for ya: last year I spoke with a Surgeon who is a recognized EXPERT in the area of Lap Band dysfunction and repair (he removed my Band). He stated in no uncertain terms that he felt that the band would be REMOVED from the market in 5 years or less, BECAUSE of the increasing incidents of erosion, and other complications. HE sees the problems on a DAILY basis. Now, I do not think that this will happen, because in spite of the many and increasing problems with the band, there have been some WONDERFUL outcomes with the Lap Band. What I THINK will happen is that the band will ultimately be considered as a “temporary” device, meant to be used for a specific period of time, and then removed, to avoid the more long-term complications such as erosion. I think that it will be hoped that the patient will utilize behavior modification techniques, and “learn” to eat differently while the band is present. There have been a few people on this board who have had their bands removed, and have gone on to maintain and continue their weight loss. It IS possible, and I think that the emphasis will eventually be shifted to this kind of concept – a temporary “aid” that will be combined with extensive Psychotherapy and Behavior modification therapies to produce the desired outcome. For those who CANNOT accomplish this and Restriction is found to be the key to their weight difficulties, then the Sleeve would be the next step.

However….for SO many people, the Sleeve SHOULD be the first and only step. It is a viable, successful form of surgery that is quickly becoming the surgery of choice for a very large segment of the Obese population.

“Do you think it is safer to cut into vital organs and re-route intestines verses putting something around one?”

Jeez. In very, very many cases, that is what the patient NEEDS. As I have said so many times before, all of these surgeries are NOT entirely interchangeable. Some people need RESTRICTION. Some need Malabsorbtion. Some need both. Some need neither; they simply need some Cheesecake Abatement Therapy.

“but it is over all the most effective and safest product as far as WLS goes.”

You keep saying this. Where DO you GET this stuff? Some of the time it is. Often it is not. You need to LEARN this.

So, as far as your future “research” goes, I have a suggestion for you.

1.) Come to this forum.

2.) PM WasaBubbleButt.

3.) Ask her your question.

4.) She will answer you.

5.) The answer will be, quite simply, AS PRECISE AS IT IS CAPABLE OF BEING. Wasa is a ROBOT as far as research. She knows what she is doing.

THAT is what you need to do, and stop reading brochures from “Omar’s Nail, Massage, and Lap Band Surgery Center”

HH

HA! I was so hoping you would see this page of this thread. I'll write it again, I heart HH.

I'm still giggling over the gold nuggets comment elsewhere. ;o)

What was the final outcome? Did you get the diagnostics done?

Might want to read this, it's from the ASMBS:

Medical News: ASMBS: Gastric Banding Less Effective than Other Procedures - in Meeting Coverage, ASMBS from MedPage Today

I am sorry but once again i disagree. If you look up the research you will see that the band is the most effective and safest over long term.

I have done the research, quite a bit. Matter of fact I read studies on a daily basis. You are making claims that even the band manufacturer does not make.

If you see the studies where they compare the gastric to the band you will see the band is equal to the gastric over a 5 year span.

Depends on which study you are referring to.

No you may not lose the weight as fast, but you keep it off longer.

I haven't read a single peer reviewed study that shows this to be correct.

The band was designed as a tool to "help" you lose the weight slowly and more naturally.

I am aware of that. I got to goal with the band.

It has it's problems like anything else, but over all is the safest.

Yes, the actual surgery is safer than a sleeve, for example by about 0.5%. Long term.. no, it most certainly is not.

Do you think it is safer to cut into vital organs and re-route intestines verses putting something around one?

I never claimed it was. Repeatedly I have said the SLEEVE is safer long term. I don't believe I mentioned gastric bypass.

others have tried to talk her into the sleeve which has proven to be non-effective.

What the heck are you talking about? Where do you get all this misinformation? It's not often I find a post with soooo much incorrect data. The sleeve is proven to be more effective than the band.

Now, 25 years ago that might have been the case because 25 years ago they were using a bigger bougie but back then it wasn't meant to be a final WLS type. Today they are using a 32F and it most certainly has not been proven ineffective and that surgery type is the fastest growing WLS type today.

so bottom line is that whatever choice you make YOU are the one that has to still do the work. YOU must still work hard on your weightloss. NONE of them will remain effective or safe if YOU don't comply with the doctor's instructions.

Actually, I am at goal and have been for 1.5 years. Are you at goal? How is your weight loss?

Remember the more you are cut into the higher your risk becomes.

I'm a nurse, I am well aware of risks and complications. I have had the band and the sleeve so I have a pretty good idea of what reality is here.

Alot of the problem still remains that the people want to blame the product instead of taking responsibility for what THEY have done wrong. They truly don't get that THEY are the ones that are still responsible for their own weightloss.

I totally blame the product. 100% I blame the product in my case.

As i said before and will say again there is an EXCEPTION to every rule, so the band isn't going to be effective 100% of the time, but it is over all the most effective and safest product as far as WLS goes.

Okay, prove it. You have repeated time and time again that the band is the most effective WLS tool today. Show me the peer reviewed studies showing that the band is more effective than DS.

I bet if you survey the people that are not happy with it. You would find out that most of them did not truly understand how the band works and they are the ones that did not have success, because they did not comply with the doctor's orders. I talk to people all the time that have had different types of WLS and i can tell they still don't get it. People that are obese (as we all are) tend to think that they can have surgery and all the fat magically disappears. Well that is not realalistic to think or believe. We did not put it on over night and we will not take it off in the same fashion. So no matter what CHOICE a person makes about weightloss whether it be WLS or the old fashion route. They need to understand that ultimately THEY are the ones that will have to do and maintain the hard work.

I really do wish you would quit lecturing me on how to lose weight. I am at goal, I got to goal in 10 months even having mega problems with the band. I've maintained my weight loss since that time. How is YOUR weight loss?

I am sorry to hear about your problems with the band, but what was said was Most of the time not All of the time. There is always an exception to every rule. What people need to look at is how many actually slip over all. Out of the thousands that have been applied how many of them that have slipped. We can't just look at one example out of thousands to get an accuarated estimate. There are risks with the band just like any surgery you have and your surgeon should have told you of them before the procedure, but overall the band is the most effective and safest thing on the market. There are many things that may cause band slippage ie..improper placement, constant vomiting,defective band( prior to surgery)non-compliance with the band and so on. So again i am sorry about your misfortune, but over all the band is the best way to go.

It is not accurate to say that the band is the most effective and safest thing on the market. It is well known and demonstrated in countless studies (including band makers studies) that the lap band is the least effective surgery type for WLS. It is the safest actual surgical procedure but it is not the safest surgery long term.

The band might be the best way for you to go, but not everyone feels the same.

You are right education is a good thing so maybe you should research a little bit more. With the sleeve the cut into and shrink your stomach, but with the lapband the just simply put the band around it. The lapband is the safest and most effective bariatric surgery on the market today. If you RESEARCH all of the surgeries you will see that. Also you will see that NONE of the surgeries are guarnteed. At the end of the day it is up to whom ever gets the which ever surgery to lose the weight and keep it off themselves. Bottomline the with any of the surgeries you can gain your weight back or not lose what you wanted to at all, so if i were to choose i would go with the lapband because atleast you can reverse that one and not have as many complcations with it.( oh oops i did go with the lapband lol)

The band is the safest actual surgery, but LONG TERM, the sleeve is the safest procedure. The sleeve carries less than 0.5% risk over the band, but long term the sleeve is the safest surgery hands down. Something to consider and especially for those self pay.

The band is most certainly NOT the most effective surgery. It has the lowest weight loss stats and the slowest weight loss stats with the highest regain of ALL surgical WLS procedures. You are not being even a little bit honest.

Complications... another dishonest statement on your part. The sleeve shows the fewest long term complications and better and faster weight loss.

You need to do some serious research before posting nonsense.

To say its mostly the peoples faults who had complications I will nicely disagree. I just found out band slipped almost a year out and I feel I was a good patient most the time a complication will arise out of nowhere I agree woth someone who said tired of pbing stuck being nauseated. Right now I feel the band takes center stage in my life it did a wonderful thing for me and I hope if oi go through fil process again and don't have it removed it will come with less complications

Totally agree with your post. Those that say otherwise are in denial.

Lastly, if your RnY or Sleeve is a disappointment, where do you go then? Your options are greatly limited apart from major surgery.

At least if there is a problem with the Lap Band, there are other viable alternatives.

Oh my, where to begin. If there is a problem with the sleeve, (IOW, if restrictive alone does not work JUST like the band) then one can revise to RNY or DS.

Education, it's a good thing.

The internet has a memory, my friend...

Internet Archive Wayback Machine

It's not on Google Cache. Funny how that works with drug companies that have unlimted pockets.

Its not about rubbing people the wrong way. Its about someone who THINKS they are a doctor and attempts to dispute everything someone else KNOWS to be fact. He skulks around the message boards TRYING to appear educated, when he does nothing more than give HIS experience as to what happened to him and discourage others from Lapband surgery because of his bad experience with it. A lot of the people here feel very vulnerable and sensitive about how they are feeling, unsure which route to go, and are loooking for someone to guide them.

He tries to make people feel inferior, thats what makes him feel superior. I feel sorry for him and anyone who thinks he does this board a service, they are obviously just like him.

We are here to support others, not "demean or dehumanize", but to encourage and support. But thats just me. Im a different person.

You may believe that what you are writing is fact but the reality is that what HH is writing is indeed fact.

I don't feel sorry for HH, I respect him.

I do think HH can be a little controversial, but let's be honest here, it takes 2 (or more sometimes) to let an argument escalate. It is unfair to blame one person. Sometimes I don't like hearing what HH or some of the others who had problems with Lapband have to say. It scares the hell out of me, makes me wonder if I made the right choice, makes me second guess everything about my surgery. I wonder if I should have gotten the sleeve, or RNY. I especially don't like hearing that Lapband isn't meant to be a long term thing. When I hear these things, and I start to second guess things, I feel defensive. I want to react, but I choose not to.

I can honestly say that sometimes I don't like what HH has to say, but he has also been supportive towards me even though I have Lapband.

And to the OP sorry to get off subject, and congrats on your decision!!!!!!!!

I totally understand what you are writing. I get it, 100%. But reality is what it is.

You are looking at this like a rational person.

Maybe the band will be the magic maker for you, it could well be! You have a band, embrace and enjoy it.

WHY do you continually insist on making everything about YOU? What in the hell is your problem?

My post had NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with YOU. NOTHING. NADA. ZIP. I didn’t even MENTION you. OR your POST. But you think the whole world is talking to YOU.

I have commented frequently in situations where people are considering traveling outside the country, and will continue to do so.

Let me point out a couple of things, and as always, for YOUR benefit I will avoid any large words:

Stacy Said: Can anyone give me any feedback? Most friends and family say "go for it". Then there are the few that say "Mexico---no way!"

And I am doing JUST THAT, Cupcake. GIVING FEEDBACK. Got that? She asked…I gave. YOU were not involved. Not at ANY POINT were YOU involved in my message to her. She ASKED FOR FEEDBACK. But….”feedback” consists of more than one syllable….I guess that’s what confused you.

“Many US Doctors will NOT provide aftercare to patients that are banded outside of the country. THERE ARE MANY DOCTORS THAT DO PROVIDE FOLLOW-UP CARE TO PATIENTS BANDED IN Mexico. I AM ONE OF THOSE PATIENTS.”

I didn’t say you WEREN’T. Again….why do you make EVERYTHING about YOU?

Get over your freakin’ self.

But I repeat: many Doctors do NOT. Fact, not My OPINION. If YOU found one that does, give Stacy his number, and then Shut UP. There’s nothing else you need to say.

“REALLY??? SHOW ME JUST ONE INCIDENT OF THIS HAPPENING IN MEXICALI.”

I’m sorry, but I don’t keep my Almanac of Mexican Violence handy at all times. And besides…I didn’t say anything remotely close to there being “Violence in Mexicali”, Did I? I merely said that there is increasing violence along the Border towns in Mexico. And that’s fact, whether YOU like it or not. When leaving the Country ANY responsible person needs to be AWARE of this….regardless of where they are going in Mexico.

“I also feel that it's very important that you be within a reasonable proximity to the facility and Surgeon that performed your procedure, in the event that there is a problem of some sort. SHE ALREADY SAID SHE IS ONLY 2 HOURS AWAY!”

She is across a NATIONAL BORDER from Mexico. Do you not understand that Mexico and the US are two entirely different countries? Jeez. Do you NOT understand that a theoretical “2 hours” does NOT mean a REAL 2 hours in the event of an EMERGENCY? I live two hours from Tijuana. But guess what, here’s a news flash for ya:: Sometimes it take 4 hours to get there….and 8 hours to get back. Anyone who is making this choice HAS to at least take that into consideration. Any REASONABLE, INTELLIGENT person, that is. But..well..uh….we’re talking about you here, so I guess THAT flies right out the window….

“WHO APPOINTED HER AS RESIDENT AUTHORITY. THERE ARE MANY OTHERS ON THIS SITE WHO HAVE GONE TO MEXICO FOR SURGERY.”

HaHa. I’m gonna tell her you said that. She’s one of the more respected members of this forum, and she has provided more information, guidance, and assistance to people here than almost anyone else. She’s had TWO surgeries in Mexico, and there is NO ONE more qualified to dispense info on researching the Topic than her. She is THE person that most everyone with any experience here refers others to on this subject. But….I guess you’re more qualified. ROFLMAO!

“Quit stalking me on this forum and move on to your next victim.”

Stalking you??? What in the hell are you babbling about?

I wouldn’t follow YOU around if you were dropping gold nuggets out of your ass.

Incidentally, I’m glad you changed your screen name here. Using “Failure” as part of your name is much more appropriately descriptive than the other one.

ATTN MODS: Again,…I didn’t start this one. I simply responded to a thread on the same subject that I have spoken on before, and “Failure” seems to want to make it all about “her”.

Gold nuggets? ;o)))))) <snark>

Hey! When are you going to call me?? (Hands on hips, stern look, giving HH the evil eye...)

A class act you are NOT! Sitting behind a computer and calling people names makes you ridiculously pathetic and small minded where I come from.

With a computer and the web at your finger tips, why would you need an almanac at all? I guess I stumped you on that one huh Smarty Pants? :wink:

HH is kinda right and kinda wrong about border towns. The US gov't is not warning about ALL of them, just specific cities. Tijuana and Juarez are two of the most dangerous cities in the world right now. Mexicali is fine.

You know what kills me is that the TJ doctors have body guards. Who is guarding their patients?

Ok my friend. But trust me I don't want my stomach removed. I'm 1 year out, kind of "medical" and personally I'm not giving it up. (unless god forbid i get stomach cancer or something)

Fat is a demon I know.

Anyway I still want your source for your stats and while I am sure you are bona fide about them i need to read and mull them myself (and consider their source) before I buy in.

i can't give you Inamed's stats, they removed them. They posted this study and the study on their 5 year (US) weight loss. It didn't turn out as good as they hoped, obviously. They took them down. I kept the links but the links are no good anymore, they went back to the old wording instead of posting the actual numbers. (And I think that's a crock, btw... they should be posting numbers not comparisons.)

Yeah, I said I'd never do anything else if I removed my band but once you bust your butt to get to goal and you know darn well without some tool you aren't going to maintain that loss, you'll do just about anything.

I didn't go through all that banding stuff and weight loss for nothing. I want to maintain.

...I can tell you that I would not EVER have had my stomach cut up or removed and I can say that if I have a band complication now or in the future I'm not sure I'd agree to the sleeve. ...

HAHA I used to say that too! When you are a noob you are all about reversible. When you get to goal you are all about permanent. ;o)

I totally like and respect Wasabubblebutt! she knows that and I want you to know it too. I think she does good research. Having said that, I want to see the studies that back up her statistics. What I found, like the link below , lists MUCH lower repairs/revisions/replacement. The only other person I know besides me who has the lap band has had it since 2003 and loves it still, no issues. That is an admittedly SMALL sample, of 1.

LAP-BAND: Statistics subframe

and another,

Long-Term Safety Data Show The LAP-BAND® Adjustable Gastric Banding System Results In Fewer Complications Compared To Gastric Bypass

Again I say ask your surgeon for stats and get the sources of those stats, review, decide. Wasa may be right and I know she thinks she is or she wouldn't post that but until I can see those figures and consider the source myself, I have to kindly say ... well, maybe, or maybe not.

This was from Inamed. They had it posted on their website for a short time along with weight loss stats. Then they took all the numbers and studies down and went back to saying weight loss is the same as bypass.

I was scheduled to be banded next week until last night I decided to look at the before and after pics, and gave myself cold feet.

I was startled by the number of people posting there that have since (noticed the updates in signatures) had slips, erosions, needed a new band, "upgraded" to the sleeve or RNY, etc. It seemed to me, it was more common than not to have some sort of complication and additional surgery following the initial band for those people that got it in 2004-05.

I got so diseartened and scared, I called my doctor and cancelled my surgery today

What exactly is the average lifespan of a band?

What % of patients are still happy bandsters 5 years down the road?

Do people being banded today have better odds at band success than those being banded 5 years ago (since it's more common, more practiced doctors)?

The thought of losing this weight of my own, without the tool of WLS for support, is overwhelming. I have been dieting or "changing my lifestyle" for the past 15 years at least and all I have to show for it is an extra 80 lbs on my body.

But the thought of going thousands of dollars in debt (yay for self-pay!) for a surgery that will only work as intended for 2-3 years....

I feel so ambivalent about the surgery now... I wonder if I chickened out over isolated, rare, incidents or if my impression was correct.

Can someone point me to some information (either studies, statistics, or personal stories) about actual long term results with this surgery?

I could never suggest banding for a self pay person. The maintenance can be extremely expensive. I really don't know how many thousands of dollars I spent trying to maintain my band with all the complications and problems.

There are studies that are showing that anywhere from 30-50% of banded people will be back in OR within the first five years to correct something band related. Slip, erosion, mechanical problem, etc.

The band manufacturers and FDA are estimating about 10 years for the band although I have never met anyone that has had a band for 10 years. Longest I have met is 9 years and she was asking me about revising to another procedure. The silicone in the band will last longer than you will, the plastic components.. well, it's plastic.

Because you are self pay I would look at the sleeve. Better and faster weight loss, NO maintenance! Fewer long term complications than the band, no mega supplements, no rerouting of intestine, no hunger causing hormone-Ghrelin, and an easier journey all the way around.