CamarilloCA

I eat such small amounts of cheese that I just eat regular cheese, but I don't have it that often.

Ah, DesertRat, nice visual! LOL! You don't want to know what I was picturing as I read that last sentence! Ugh.

FitnessDiva, you rock!

Well, I have no doubt that the people who are experience dumping are in fact feeling an unpleasant sensation. I also think that there are some sleevers who don't have this same feeling. For those that are, please consider that there may be different reasons for this happening, and those should be considered also. In the cause and effect equation, there is often more than one cause or even a different cause than suspected. For example, how many of you experiencing dumping have your gallbladders still? Gallbladders process fat, but after a period of a liquid diet or lowfat diet, bile can turn into a sludge and not do what it's supposed to do, which is to break down fat. Gall stones can be super painful, and so a lot of people have their gallbladders out at the time of surgery to avoid problems. If you still have your gallbladder, it may not be breaking down fat well, and you will have diarrhea when you eat fat that is not broken down. If you don't have your gallbladder, the same is true. Other causes should also be considered and were also mentioned in this thread and include: low blood pressure, high blood pressure, stress, low B12, some Vitamin or mineral deficiency, etc. Diarrhea is also not uncommon in the first few months after surgery. Some of us have an excess of stomach acid as well, which is also a factor. Also, when you eat a meal, that is often what your body needs to expel what is being kept in the intestines and get that system going. That doesn't mean that you are expelling what you just ate. Just food for thought there. The brain needs sugar to function and is very efficient at getting it. However, there is no doubt that we as Americans eat way too much sugar and that we would all be better off not eating processed sugary foods and eating fruit and natural sugars instead. If someone believes that processed sugar is making them sick, then maybe that is a good thing for them. However, I also think there are many of us that can eat the same sugary foods that we used to eat, and we have to face that demon head on and choose not to eat them because we know that, in order to have the lean healthy bodies that we desire, we need to stay away from processed sugar. I always thought the term "dumping" refers not to what is expelled but rather undigested food traveling from the stomach into the small intestine without being digested fully. Here's the Wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia....umping_syndrome

I just want to suggest that taller people do not have longer stomachs and may not allow for more food. There is a thread here somewhere with information about this topic. A study was done of stomach sizes in deceased people, and even though people had some organs that were different sizes than other people and proportionate to their overall size, there was not a lot of variation in stomach size. Maybe the esophagus is longer? I don't know, but I do think that the theory that taller people can eat more isn't correct. I also believe that the sleeved stomach will not stretch much as it is not made with the fundus, the stretchy part of the stomach. JMHO.

Here's another view of some bougie sizes: http://www.medovations.com/pdf/Esophageal_Dilatation.pdf

I could be wrong, but what comes out of you today has more to do with what you ate 24 hours earlier. It takes about that long from the time you eat something until the time it comes out of you. Sometimes it takes even longer. However, dumping syndrome is from your stomach to your intestines (not what comes out of you) and can create a feeling of nausea, dizziness, heart pounding, etc., but it is not suppose to occur with sleeve patients. I think it happens with gastric bypass though.

I have a 38, and I think it is the best of both worlds. I can take six pills at once (supplements), and I never had a problem with drinking liquids quickly to get rehydrated, and I never vomited once other than in the hospital the day after surgery. I feel restriction quickly, but I can take more than five bites. I can eat a whole taco, and that's about it for a meal if I want to. It's a size that I can live with for the rest of my life. The smaller sizes work too, but I think there is more of a risk of strictures and problems with a smaller sleeve. You will lost weight either way, and ultimately, it won't affect your weight loss. I would trust your surgeon's advice.

I would try to discourage anyone from getting implants. I had them put in when I was young, and one ended up rupturing. I finally had them removed last year, and I am so glad that they are gone. Just please do some research before you have them put in. Here's a forum that I joined when I had a rupture: http://www.breastimplantsupport.org/index.php Breast implants only last for about ten years maximum before they can leak or rupture. I had mine 27 years, but they were covered in scar tissue and encapsulated so the silicone didn't leak into my body as far as I know. Just know that, if you have them put in, you will have to have them removed or replaced in another surgery down the road. I am definitely planning on having a breast lift as my breasts are super saggy, but I will have to wait until I have lost all my weight to be sure. DD is pretty awesome; my advice would be to consider a lift instead for the sake of your health and back.

The cost of revision surgery here in the states can vary, but I would say that the typical cost is around $18,000, which includes surgeon's fee, anesthesia, and a one-night hospital stay, but all that is negotiated really with the doctor that you end up going with. Many people go to Mexico, where there are reputable doctors and decent hospitals and the cost is much lower. Do a search for "cost" at the main forum, and I'm sure you'll find lots of discussions about price. There is even a forum for people who had their surgery in Mexico. Here is my thread on my cost: http://www.verticals...__fromsearch__1 Here is another thread I found: http://www.verticals...__1#entry358683 I'm sure you can find others as well by doing a search for "bill" or "price" or "cost."

Has anyone been watching this show? It's been very interesting, eye-opening, and heart-breaking in some cases. One thing that I thought was interesting that I thought I would share. I will try to get this right. There was a study of twins that ate the same identical diet and did the same exercise and have the same genetic make up. One of the twins was thin all his life while the other twin had gained weight (50 pounds?) at some point and lost the weight again. Both were the same weight, however, at the time of the study. Even though they ate the same meals with the same portions, the one that had never gained weight didn't gain weight while the one who had once gained weight did gain again. The result of the study was this: the twin who had once gained weight and lost it again needed to take in fewer calories than his twin to maintain his weight. In other words, when they sat down to an identical meal, the twin that had gained and lost weight in the past had to eat less of the meal than his brother in order to stay the same weight. I thought this was interesting. I don't know if their metabolism was the same or not. I don't think they said. I do know that it would be impossible for me to maintain a healthy bodyweight if I didn't have my sleeve to keep my portions small. My eyes or my brain tells me the portions that I want to eat, but my sleeve knows better what I really need. I know that I will need to keep my portions less than what other people eat for the rest of my life, and I'm glad I have the sleeve to help me with that.

Thanks for your comments:-) Well, it is a series with new ones every week so maybe other things will be covered in the future. I do know that one episode was about the corn industry and subsidies and about how the farmers get money to grow corn and how they don't get subsidies to grow other vegetables so it is an incentive for them to just grow the one crop of corn. And the corn is made into corn syrup and other substances that basically go into everything. It also mentioned the powerful lobbists and industries that would make changing this difficult, but they mentioned that no one thought things could change in the world of cigarettes and tobacco 50 years ago, and yet things did change there as research came out about the health costs of smoking. There were a few segments on weight loss surgery but not much. I agree that it is good to educate people about how difficult it is lose weight and keep it off, and I think this program is showing that nicely.

Just another food for thought: I could be wrong, but I don't think that the protein shakes, like the Premier Protein that Costco has or like Muscle Milk, are actually supposed to be meal replacement shakes. I don't think they will give you the complete nutrition that you need over the long term if one just drinks those instead of meals. There are meal replacement shakes that you can buy, but they are fairly expensive. I think HMR and Optifast are meal replacement shakes, but many others are not. Also, I don't think there is much if any fiber in shakes and other things that your body needs so it wouldn't surprise me if someone declined in health if they were on the protein shakes longterm.

I've never seen any evidence of two competing philosophies here. I think everyone, for the most part, follows the plan that their doctor or nutritionist recommends, and they can vary from one doctor to another. It seems that your doctor's plan varies greatly from other recommended stages post surgery that I've seen. While it is true that you need to supplement your diet with Protein shakes in the first two weeks or so of healing because you can't take in enough protein, following that stage, there are soft foods that have lots of protein like fish, lean turkey, string cheese, cottage cheese, egg whites, milk, etc. Since most doctors have high protein requirements, protein shakes are good to add in addition to a meal, but I don't think many people here advocate having a Protein shake in place of all three meals. That would defeat the purpose of the surgery. Why would you have a tool put in if you are not going to use it? Most of us make a huge investment by having this surgery and want to use our tool as soon as possible. Having this tool in place pretty much ensures that we won't go back to our old eating habits. For one thing, you will never eat the portion size that you once used to. Secondly, snacking on healthy foods is often beneficial for keeping your metabolism up. Lastly, I think most of us feel that we didn't go through this expense, this pain, and this surgery to end up sabotaging our weight loss with poor choices. That's not to say that we might choose something less than healthy from time to time, but that's a far cry from eating habits pre-surgery. Keeping you on a liquid diet only delays the inevitability that you must eat solid food again and make better choices. If you have 900 calories a day on a liquid diet of protein shakes or you have 900 calories a day on healthy food, there is no difference between the amount of weight loss that you will see. I personally don't see the logic in keeping a new sleever on a Liquid Protein shake diet for that amount of time. I did a program called HMR, which were also Meal Replacement shakes, for three months a long time ago. I lost 30 pounds, which immediately came back when I switched to "real food." Fortunately, I don't think that would happen to someone with a sleeve, but I do think that learning to work with your new sleeve as soon as you are healed is a good thing.

I was cleared for mushies after ten days, and I pretty much went to soft foods right around the two-week mark, and so you are not really that off schedule in my opinion. Different doctors have different guidelines for their patients. The important thing to remember is to chew well and not drink when you eat. Sipping while eating is going to cause you discomfort. Try to wait 30 minutes after eating before you take a drink.

I was in the same boat as you not long ago as many others are here. Be sure to check out the lap band to sleeve revision forum and insurance forum as both are helpful. I too had the lap band put in in 2008 (see "My Story" on my Profile Page). I just had revision surgery eight weeks ago to the sleeve. I have Kaiser, and I didn't have to go through classes for the revision, and they covered everything. I had self-paid for the lap band, but I would have qualified through Kaiser back in 2008 if I had wanted to wait for six months while I took the classes. (Classes were once a week for six months in Los Angeles back then.) I was impatient and ended up self paying for the band. I would make an appointment with your Primary Care Provider and ask him/her to refer you to the barriatric program. I think just having the lap band in makes you qualify for having it out at the least and having revision surgery if you want it. I wouldn't think you have to qualify again. At the very minimum, you'll probably have to have an Upper G.I. so that they can see where the band is and what it is doing. You'll also have some blood tests, etc., prior to surgery and possibly an endoscopy.

Yes, here are some links which talk about bougie size, and the last link is an actual picture of one: http://www.verticalsleevetalk.com/topic/37822-bougie-to-big/page__hl__bougie__fromsearch__1 http://www.verticalsleevetalk.com/topic/39587-bougie-sizes/page__hl__bougie__fromsearch__1 http://www.verticalsleevetalk.com/topic/36606-what-size-french-bougie/page__hl__bougie__fromsearch__1 http://www.medovations.com/pdf/Esophageal_Dilatation.pdf

I have staples closing my stomach incision. They are all different colors:-) But I assume you are talking about exterior staples. My husband had them closing the incision for his back surgery, and removing them wasn't painful, he said. I had glue myself because I'm allergic to the tape.

Hi Erika, I totally agree with what others have said. I had the band for four years, and I initially lost about 25 pounds and then another 10 or so in the beginning, but then the 10 came back and stayed back despite my throwing up at every meal. I couldn't eat hardly anything healthy without it coming right back up. I learned to eat sliders so that I wouldn't throw up and could feel full. I couldn't eat bread, shrimp, eggs, chicken, or anything dry with the band and learned to smother everything with mayo. It turns out that I had massive scar tissue and adhesions around my port, around my band, and around my stomach on the inside of the band. When the surgeon removed my band, my stomach was still held tightly together until he could release it by removing scar tissue. I know this because I got my operative report from the hospital. I just had the band taken out and the sleeve put in almost 8 weeks ago, and I've lost 27 pounds so far. I have a 38 French bougie, and the only time that I had nausea and threw up was the day after surgery and not since then. Now I can eat healthy food with Fiber, which is something that I couldn't do with the band. Now I can eat anything I want and choose to eat healthy, and I get satiated quickly even with my small portions.

I have a 38 French bougie, and my surgeon uses that size for everyone. I'm pretty short too and doubt that I have a long stomach. It seems like I can eat more than a lot of new sleevers, but I just eat until I am satiated. I can eat a whole taco from Taco Bell, but I don't go there very often. I can eat what Heather listed she eats. I also don't have much problem with liquids. I can get in a lot of liquid at once as long as I don't chug it and pause between a few gulps. Liquid gets absorbed very fast anyway so I doubt that has anything to do with stomach size. I wonder too if scar tissue plays a role here. If scar tissue builds up around the incision line and staples on the outside of the stomach as well as the inside, could that be causing some restriction as well in our new stomachs? I do think it is possible to get to have a few more bites with a bigger sleeve. I've heard a lot of sleevers who got their sleeve in Mexico say that they got a 30 or 32 and that they can take about five bites of Protein like steak. I can get in about ten bites and a tablespoon or so of Beans.

I don't track my calories either. I only take a few bites of something anyway, which makes it hard to calculate without actively measuring everything. I don't believe that I get in more than 1000 calories a day, and I do try to get in at least 60 grams of Protein, but I probably actually get in more protein than that. I always try to eat protein first at every meal, and I don't snack much between meals. My feeling is this: when you are stalled, you are probably losing inches as your body adjusts. This can be verified by using a measuring tape during the stalls. If your metabolism has slowed to match your intake, then you need to increase your metabolism with exercise. Certain supplements can also boost metabolism as well. My feeling is that, during a stall, increasing exercise, not calories, is the best thing you can do, but that is just how I want to manage my body and may not work well for others. As for increasing calories by eating more, I wouldn't want to do that for me. I try to listen to my body and eat only when I am hungry. I do have whatever I want as long as it is a healthy food, and I don't worry about calories. For example, eating a half of an avocado with cottage cheese is a good healthy fat and is filling and delicious. And so I say eat and enjoy healthy food with protein first and then things like salad and fruit. Watermelon is a delicious high Fiber food which has been given a bad rap as being high sugar in the past (Dr. Oz show). My advice is to start to eat today the way you will eat the rest of your life, and the weight will come off. From the Dr. Oz show: "Watermelon’s red pulpy flesh contains the “mother of all antioxidants,” glutathione, which is known to help strengthen the immune system. It’s also high in Vitamins C and A. As if that weren’t enough to convince you to eat more of this superfruit, among fruits and vegetables, watermelon has the highest concentration of lycopene, the powerful antioxidant that helps fight heart disease and cancer."

I started having coffee again a few weeks after surgery, and it is no problem. I drank it every day for four years while I had the lap band and didn't get ulcers. It is acidic, but so is tea, orange juice, and many other things. Coffee and caffeine are actually good for you in moderation and have been shown in studies to prevent all sorts of cancers. The darker coffee Beans have more antioxidents. Dr. Oz even recommends it on his show. I personally have espresso, and I mix it with a lot of 1% or 2% milk, which is a good source of Protein. If you look at video blogs of successful sleevers on You Tube, many of them have coffee in the morning with milk or Protein shakes. Do what feels right to you. Your body will tell you whether it works for you or not. My opinion is that we are giving up a lot of the fat and sugar in our diet that we used to love to eat, and so giving up an almost zero calorie beverage is a little ridiculous. Just make sure that you use Splenda or Stevia and watch the fat grams or sugar content of any creamer that you use. This is must my opinion, but I never was too keen on letting others dictate what I do in my life.

Liliana, you are an inspiration to me: 80 pounds in 6 months lost. Your start weight and goal are about the same as mine. I've been under the impression that, the less you have to lose, the slower you lose weight, but you've made great progress. I would love to know what you are eating, how much you exercise, and whether you have loose skin issues. And, just to keep this on topic, I think this is a great thread, and I forsee that I will have skin sagging issues. I am 48, and my skin is not as elastic as it used to be. When I lost 70 pounds on Phentermine in my 30's, I had no skin issues, but I am sure I will this time. Vitamin E oil is supposed to be good as well for skin; although, I don't know if it will actually shrink sagging skin. Safflower oil is also good for skin according to Dr. Oz show, and I may try Coconut Oil and Argan Oil as well.

Just another chuckle: I received the Explanation of Benefits for my anesthesia today. The topic should read that my surgery bill was $96,861.28 because my Anesthesiologist billed $2880.00 for me of which $1945.08 was disallowed and $934.92 was paid, making the actual amount paid for my surgery a grand total of $18,722.92. Thank you to Kaiser Permanente!

I received my Explanation of Benefits in the mail today from Kaiser Permanente. It tells me what was billed by the hospital and doctors, what was disallowed, and what was allowed and paid. This was for my lap band to sleeve revision, and I spent two nights in the hospital. For my surgeon: Charged: $13,750 Disallowed: $10,350 Allowed and paid $3400 For my hospital stay: Charged: $80,231.28 Disallowed: $75,843.28 Allowed and paid $14,388.00 And so the total amount that Kaiser paid was $17,788. I didn't even have a co-pay, and the member responsibility was $0. I feel so blessed to have Kaiser Insurance. Now, we do pay out of pocket for our health insurance, and our premiums come to about $12,000 a year, but it is great insurance to have. I paid cash to have my lap band put in at a surgery center in 2008, and that came to about $14,500. I just thought somebody might find this interesting. It just shows how our whole medical system is screwed up in this country. If my insurance hadn't paid for this, I would have gone to Mexico like many have done.