CowgirlJane

@@lisacaron what i think is funny and contradictory in my reply is that I do think it is "expected" and appreciated for the guy to pay for the first date or two, but if i am out dancing or something with friends or with a meetup group and dance with somoen - i NEVER EVER let anyone buy me a drink. I too don't want to feel beholden... funny how I make the distinction isn't it?

NOT weighing regularly is one of the enablers of how I got to be over 300#. For me, weighing regularly is a key accountability step. So, if you are the type to freak out over every little up and down - don't do it. If you are the type that understands weight fluctuates a little, you retain and release Water weight for unknown reasons, and it is the trend you are monitoring, i think it can be helpful. Just don't drive yourself (and us!) crazy everytime the scale doesn't match what you think it should (hey, I followed my program yesterday why did i gain a pound!?!) when I was in the loss phase i weighed daily, but only Monday was my official weigh in day. In maintenance I weigh around 3-4 times a week.

I have a friend who is a bariatric dietician and she feels that a larger portion of her patients don't completely understand expectations. she had theories about it including education levels, ability to read well etc but i actually doubt that is the primary issue. I think that WLS is incredibly emotional, many of the people who go through it are not in the best state of mind at the moment (anxiety, fear, hopelessness, wishing for a miracle etc) that they just CAN'T HEAR the details.... it is like deer in the headlights kind of thing. I could be wrong of course, but my sense from reading some of the things posted here... people going to USA based surgeons with bariatric programs who say they were not told "fill in the blanks" and I have decided that all those programs can't be THAT lacking in basic info. This isn't a judgement against those patients - I was pretty rattled too - my personality type is to dig and to try to understand every nit when i am rattled.

So sorry you feel bad! I imagined that sleeve surgery would be terribly painful - like the stomach would hurt. In reality that is not what i experienced. I experienced some nasuea from the anesthesia (I always do) but they kept me pumped full of anti-nasueau drugs so i didn't throw up. I felt like i had done 1000 situps from the muscle repair - only time it was really bad is when i mistakenly tried to use my ab muscles one day post op! I felt some pain in my shoulder due to the gas they blow you up with Mostly, I felt kinda tired, scared and exhausted from trying to get fluids in etc. It was so much work to get back to eating solid food (over a long period of time of many weeks as per my surgeon's plan). Eating became a "chore" which at times was emotionally uncomfortable. I know not everyone has the same experience, but for most of us the physical pain wasn't really the hard part. That was all 4 years ago come December and it was all so worth it. Feel better soon!

First meeting....keep it to a coffee or something like that. Pay for it (just trust me on this one). If you decide to meet again choose something comfortable for your means and offer to pay. Actually my advice would be to insist. Once in a relationship I would offer to take my man "out" and would insist on paying for those events. We did a big new years eve out and while he probably paid 60 percent but I picked up some of it too. I think that 50-50 or something similar is reasonable once you are in a relationship. It sounds trite and stupid but people want to feel valued early on in the "courtship". I think traditionally that means girls show up made up and looking awesome (my hair, clothes,make up, nails are well thought out for the setting) guys pay. Okay, flame me, but when I first started dating I didn't understand these social nuances and in my efforts to be m 50-50 I missed some opportunities. My comments all assume you are in somewhat similar or better economic situation as those you date.

The EWL is about what I thought it should be too.. the disappointment is probably more about diabetes remission rates?

Okay, i just read up on wellbutrin. My counselor was against it as it triggers anxiety in many people (I read alot about this)...however, it is very effective at solving the lack of concentration aspect of anxiety. That is my #1 symptom so i wonder if it is worth trying, especially since it tends to promote appetite reduction. It is scary for me to try something that MIGHT trigger more anxiety though because i feel like I am managing it "ok" and just dread it getting worse - it is the worst feeling! My counselor is on vacation until next week and i am impatiently waiting. Thinking about going to see my primary doc instead because frankly, i don't want to talk about it. I have talked and talked and I can't change this underlying issue.

I did EMDR - the flashy light/sound thing. It was very focused - I think I did about 4-6 treatments and I went from having full on panic/I am back in the moment of the trauma to being able to view them as memories without a panic attack. It was life changing at that time. In my experience it helped tremendously with post traumatic stress over specific incidents but not so much with the trauma childhood as a general concept. It helped me alot but I probably won't do it again. I can share more about this later if anyone is interested. I can tell you a therapy NOT to do - called Lifespan Integration. It made me sick. My girlfriend who did it developed hives and her hair started falling out. I come to the conclusion that there are some things the subconscious isn't really ready to share with the conscious world... better left buried. Interesting about wellbutrin - I was told that is an anti-depressant that is known to trigger anxiety but clearly for you it is very effective! One of the good things is it doesn't tend to cause weight gain. Is clonazepam one of the ones they say is addictive? That "group" of drugs helps me alot but my doc will only prescribe it like 5 pills at a time to deal with a specific anxiety event like my whole breast mystery thing. One of my best friend has a doctor who prescribes that type of drug generously and she uses them daily with no apparent ill effect, but I guess the current thinking is that we will all become anti-anxiety junkies.

I thought that 60% excess weight loss was "expected" from sleeve in long term. 56% is lower than that, but not crazy different. Is the big topic here about the diabetes remission rates not being as good? I also think it is important to know what they use to calculate the "target weight" when they do the EWL calc. It is not the upper end of the normal BMI, it is somewhere in the middle. Speaking for my personal situation, when I got down to 140 which I believe was my target, even my doctor thought i was too thin. I liked being thin, but when I look at photos now I recognize that perhaps bones sticking out from your back is not all that lovely. My point is that people who were obese often wind up "heavy" on the scale for their size so losing 100% of excess may not be attainable or even completely desirable for all. Having said that, due to my joint problems, i would actually prefer to be lighter again to get pressure off my hip and knees... regardless of how I look. From the article: In their retrospective analysis of a prospective cohort study of 443 patients who underwent bariatric surgery at the university hospital between 2006 and 2013, the percentage of excess body weight lost had dropped from 77% in 241 patients with available data at 1 year to 56% among 39 at 5 years

I am clearly not an effective communicator. I have not been trying hard. I became one of those flakes we all hate. Like, i had a profile but didn't respond to emails, met very few people and then even when i liked someone generally didn't follow through with a second date (or even returning their messages which is rude and i hate that i have done that). I am just tired of it and need a break from the entire topic. I posted about mr hair puller, even though I convinced myself to give him another try, I didn't. One thing that I think many people don't realize is that middle aged women have a very hard time meeting age appropriate men who are interested in serious relationships. It doesn't mean it isn't possible - but there are a lot of mid life crisis - finding wings going on out there in this age range. In general, I hit it off with men a decade older than me (they just seem less nuts as a population - ha!) but that comes with it's own set of things to think about at this age. I have made a couple of friends through this online dating thing - actually one of my dearest friends I met 2 years ago on POF. We never dated, but just hit it off and I coached him through the process of attracting his current girlfriend who is a great match for him! anyway, I am quite fine with my dance lessons, hosting and attending gatherings of friends and family, my horses, my live music, my festivals and wine tastings etc. Like I said, I would like a special someone in my life, but this thing called dating has lost its allure, at least for now.

Profile isnt my problem, get plenty of dates... just thinking my head is isn't into it all right now. I sincerely want a relationship but don't really want to date. It was fun for awhile but it just isn't right now... and often feels like a waste of my precious time. I hope I find a way forward at some point.

I am not talking about the xanax type - those are intended for short term relief of acute anxiety like people get when they are faced with a scary medical procedure or something. They are addictive and what is worse, they can cause a "boomerang" if you take it too long and start to create anxiety. I am talking about the class of drugs that you take daily, more like the anti-depressant/anti anxiety classes of drugs. I tried very low dose of Lexapro last year and it worked but it gave me flulike symptoms after I had been on it a month or so so i went off it. The doc had suggested something called busebar because it apparently rarely causes the typical side effects but it is a bit of a sedative so I kind of worried about that aspect. The ARNP/counselor I saw last year is on vacation so I am just doing my natural things that are helping ALOt. Taking melatonin before bed to help ensure a good nights sleep Daily vigorous walk Eating reguarly - no fasting or trying to lose weight right now 5HTP - the pill form never worked for me but I am using the sublingual tabs and feel it does help (some) Doing calming practices like deep breathing etc. I do feel better, and if I thought i could maintain like this, I would probably not seek out the meds but i am just tired of it and want to not fight it all the time. Also, i want to relose about 20# to get under goal again and I don't dare try seriously buckling down when I now know that it can contribute to that uneasy feeling I get. The thing about anxiety is that there are a bunch of different types. I don't have social anxiety, i don't worry over an event, or a thing. It is more like an undercurrent of tension that isn't attached to anything. It does interfere with my ability to sit and concentrate at times as I tend to want to "move" when I am feeling this way. It is hereditary - my Mom had it quite severe and other family members have had it to lesser degrees. On top of that, i have some traumatic events in life that are known to cause this condition, but i really think it is the hereditary element because i have been to talk and EMDR therapy for the trauma things.

I went to a "reunion" of sorts - people who I worked with on a very big project about 15-18 years ago. I was a "young woman" in my 30s then, but due to obesity aged beyond my years. Now, we are all a little older, a little mellower and for me ALOT thinner. I have been at goal since Feb 2013 so most people hardly remember what I looked like before - in fact somebody at the party mentioned that (I still work with her so she has seen me alot). It was uncomfortable at times to get all the remarks, and I felt like my former 9retired) boss was uncomfortable around me (happened last time i saw him too, shortly after getting to goal). Since so many people post about being uncomforrtable about people noticing their weight loss, I thought i would share two specific stories that came up at this party. First, a lady that has always been thin, beautiful, tall blah blah blah. She made comments about how she had seen my face in pictures, but never really got a look at my body and just went on and on about how much I have changed. The longer and louder she got, the more defensive I started to feel. I recognized it and made the decision to do what I decided in 2012/2013 about work colleagues - these are people that respected and included me even when i didn't feel I deserved it, so I am going to suffer through some of their current rudeness knowing they are just expressing alot of things they don't know how to express in the best way. It was like... deep breath.... I can get through this even when she said "I think you are about half the size you used to be!". I told her that was the truth, I lost about half my size which of course is an indirect way of giving people an idea how much you lost. But seriously, when you used to be in the 24W-32W size range and are now single digit sizing - it is not exactly a secret is it!?! I knew her intentions were good, this lady is also a horse rider and she never made me feel like I was too big to be involved with horses or any of those kinds of things. Anyway, it was difficult for me, but the end result was getting invited on a trip to Hawaii with her and a small group of "girls" that were on that same project! Why didn't she invite me before? Well, to be honest, because in the past i could be standoffish/separate myself from others and often refused invitations etc from work related people especially. I am thrilled to be going and they are thrilled to have me. Second, the host of this event is a few years younger and was actually a single guy when I worked with him. Anyway, he is super outgoing/outrageous type of personality so he was really over the top vocal about how much I have changed. I could tell it was even making other people I work with (who are well over the shock) uncomfortable. Finally, one of the guys i work with said in response to his gushing about how different I look "yes M, you already said that". To which M replied, "but what i haven't said is not only do you look great from losing all that weight, you somehow turned out hot!" That got nods of approval and good laughs all around. It was a boost for me as I am 10# over goal, and of course notice my waist isn't as small as it was a year ago etc but i am still doing great. Moral of my story - well, there probably isn't one, but at least for me embracing other people's reactions to my epic physical transformation is part of my epic internal transformation. I have always felt I am a person with integrity, honesty, but this having to face stuff like this has forced me to dig deeper for a level of transparency and trust of others that isn't always comfortable. The thought that helps me alot is the knowledge that these SAME people accepted me, advocated for me, promoted me, respected me, worked with me and did alot of other great things even when I was morbidly obese (as they should of course!)

This is my fear about getting facework... a bit of numbness around the belly button is no problem but i worry about it for the face.

I am sorry you are going through this. My EX was not gay but had no interest in physical intimacy of any kind. There were signs early on, but over the years it became soul crushing to not be hugged, kissed or receiving any intimacy. i blamed it on my obesity for a long time, but turns out that WASN'T it. I have no answer for it because I still care deeply for him, still miss him. I am single now and at times regret that decision, but truth is I was so terribly lonely being in a relationship where i felt neither part of a couple nor free to be single. This was way beyond the sex part, it was the whole way we interrelated with each other and the world. Since you clearly love her, i hope you are able to give the process time before making any "permanent" decisions. This must be terribly difficult however.

Thinking of you Denise!

Thank you for pasting that in Kelly. You know, I lost 150# to get to goal but lost more than that post sleeve. I worked my effing ass off though, so I suppose it can be misleading to think my results are "typical" right now, I weigh 10# over goal and really want to be under goal, but, in truth, I look good/feel good so I am not stressing about it. However, it gets harder and harder and I have not even hit the 4 year mark (December!) @@Chimera I would like to talk to you about your anxiety meds and any advice. I understand they won't prescribe xanax type drugs due to the addictive nature, so I am talking about going on something "like" Lexapro that I did for short duration last year. I got flulike symptoms from that drug, but the anxiety relief was incredible. Even after going off, it lasted a really long time, it was my recent health issues that triggered a "flare up". I am doing pretty good at the moment, but i am just tired of feeling like a tightrope walker, know what I mean? I read on one of the BP forums a lady talking about how she got addicted to pain meds, and she figured out during recovery it was because it relieved her anxiety. I wonder if that is a common theme among SOME obese (formerly as well) that underlying anxiety is a key issue.

The woman who took her life - well, she had shared with me some problems in her personal life that were getting her down big time. I don't think it is fair to call that the "reason" though - people who have so much to live for don't end it all just because relationships are rocky etc unless there is some sort of underlying chemical imbalance. I am doing oh so much better anxiety wise. Using a natural remedy, making myself do the things that make me feel better daily walks,, every other day ride on my trusty older horse, limiting caffeine, eating more consistently (I get anxious when my blood sugar gets low when i am in a bad time like now), taking remedies to ensure decent sleep - all the hygene things I know that help me.. Although i feel better, Viv's death has made me rethink my approach and I am going to try meds again. I guess I feel like I have "tried hard enough" on my own and I just don't want to have to put so much energy into managing/preventing anxiety. It reminds me alot of my weight loss journey - just reaching the point where you realize that wishing/will power just doesn't always work. I have put a great deal of thought into how I want to move forward in life and I realize that fighting anxiety isn't really what I want in the forefront of my life. It really hit me as I contemplated things - I am HAPPY. I have so many things going right (work, kids, house and home, friends etc etc) and I like myself. You know what i mean - none of us are perfect but that hole in my heart (metaphorically) seems to be healing quite nicely and is no longer a cavern. I don't mind being alone so much - in fact I have been loving horseback riding alone the last few weeks. I feel comfortable in my skin and even though I am 10# over goal, I still love my body and my progress. I have plenty of room for further growth - no denying that - but I am happy with my life. So, I think that my anxiety is the inherited disorder that my mother (had very severely) my full sister had (diagnosed with general anxiety order in her 20s), my niece suffers from etc. and it is not something I can "will" away. I used food and obesity to manage/mask it much of my life. The last few years I haven't been using food that way and all the replacements are temporary (hard exercise, etc etc) and stop working over time. So, I called the counselor/ARNP I saw last year and she is on vacation for 2 more weeks. i am trying to decide if I should wait that long or go to my primary care because i just want relief and to move forward. I have made some decisions about my horse life to that are "freeing". I got funding for my mega project at work (woo hoo!) I just got invited to join a wonderful group of ladies for a week in Maui next Feb My home updating will start this fall Many good things

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2 years in October. I haVE some numbness between belly button and LBL and close to the srarline in back. Zero numbness in breast, arms or thighs. I have less numbness on belly then I did a year ago.... Dr Sauceda tells people to give it two years.

I think your reasons are spot on. Another comment....you are high Bmi and so those problems you don't have yet are likely to start showing up. I am normal weight now but decades of obesity have left me with a bad hip and knees.

I was raised in a very volitale household, and as a result, i had a bad temper as a young woman. I would sometimes just need to walk away to cool down. For some people that is a good coping strategy and i don't think it is fair to expect someone to be "in contact" when they have put themselves in a timeout. My EX would get so mad at me, and all needed was like 20 minutes to clear my head so i could think clearly and have a rational conversation - I never did anything bad nor was i ever gone for more then a short walk around the neighborhood - i just needed a little space and i would hope a partner could respect that sort of need. however, threatening to hit, throwing things... I feel those are intentional intimidation tactics and a precursor to violence. I have no idea about this man - if he is quite young and came from a difficult background, perhaps just some coaching/counseling/learning stress management skills could be the solution. Is he open to it? Sorry you have to deal with this - it sucks.

Okay, as a person who raised two boys as a single mom... I say WHOA on immediately dumping the father of your children. There are consequences to consider here.... Having said that, I would find being called a fat ass and other such things to be completely unacceptable from my lover/partner/spouse. Off the hook unacceptable, inexcuseable. And to any ladies who name call your man - same for you - that is not the right way to treat someone you love, honor and cherish and all that jazz. It has been my experience that these things get worse, not better with time so it needs to be dealt with. Consider relationship counseling because what happens when you get thin and now instead of being a "fatass" you become a "slut" or some other such degrading remark because of of how you look? I am sorry you are dealing with this.

@@OKCPirate that link did NOT lead to research showing comparable results.... in fact it looks like pretty dated info as they were essentially "testing" the sleeve.

I am so glad you are NOT going with the lapband. Some tough talk here, you are pretty high BMI and the band is completely unsuited for that situation in my opinion based on my personal experience of being the not so proud owner of one of them for a decade.... I was a BMI of about 52 when I revised from the band to sleeve. The first surgeon thought I was too high of BMI/failed history for the sleeve and I should go with RNY. I chose a different surgeon who did think I was a good candidate for the sleeve and i have done very well (I revised to sleeve in Dec 2011) If I was higher BMI, I would seriously consider the RNY or the DS procedures. I don't know much about it, but there is a new DS technique that seems to have less side effects and for people with alot to lose, the DS is by far the most effective. It is also the procedure with the most "issues" including defieciencies so it is about tradeoffs... Anyway, do your research because failing and revising to another procedure is really tough, physically, emotionally etc. Really learn about the options and chose the one that has good research to back it up being successful for your goals, amount of weight loss desired etc. Good luck!!!