PdxMan

I've been avoiding this thread as my posts have been regarded as being the rigid naysayer while nothing further can be the truth. I agree with Fiddle, this has, at times, been a dangerous thread. We would love to believe that everyone thinks the same way we do, but that is not the truth. Sorry Cheri, but I couldn't disagree more with the statement I quoted from your post. People who truly are addicts cannot do this, otherwise, they wouldn't be addicts. Do you really believe the heroin addict can just quit whenever they CHOOSE to? One of the tenets of addiction is the power of choice has been removed. I believe this to be true for food addicts, too, and it doesn't take much for someone who is on the fence about using xxx (fill in the blank) to be pushed over to perhaps making a poor decision. I understand the intent of the thread, but as I posted earlier, I believe the intent strayed and became something else. It has flowed back to what I believe the OP intent was, a confessional, but as you point out, there have been several posts that are just downright scary. As I stated earlier, I worry about the person researching the sleeve, reading this thread and thinking, "Oh, so I can still sit down and eat Cheetos after I get sleeved" or "I just need to spit out the Doritos after I chew them". As I have shared, I am also in AA. It would scare the heck out of me to be sitting in a place I thought was safe and the discussion was glorifying what we drank last night. As I have done with this thread, I would get up and leave, but I have to ask if we have any responsibility to the person who is struggling and just happens to walk into the room? Again, I am fine with the original intent of the thread, confession, as that is a large part of AA, too. But some of the posts are, IMO, dangerous and enabling. If I truly had a choice in my relationship with food, I would have never needed this surgery.

Have you had a blood screen lately? I believe I was in a bout of depression a few months back. A co-worker of mine had mentioned that she had gotten on a Vitamin D kick as she had heard (from Dr Oz, I believe) that Vitamin D (with calcium) supplements were like sunshine in a bottle. I had a physical coming up and wouldn't you know my D levels were quite low. Of course, I hadn't been taking my vitamin supplements like I had, so, I made a commitment to myself to get back on track. I can report, for me, that I found similar results. Sunshine in a bottle. I feel so much better and am amazed at how the cloud of depression has lifted for me. I would say about 10 days after I started I noticed the change and I'm feeling great.

Anything with liquid is going to slide right through, pretty much. The pyloric valve opens up when the contents of the stomach are in a liquidy, pasty state. If it is going in like that, then it will not stay for long. Again, as I mention in my first reply, solid foods begin to give you restriction. Lean Protein will provide the greatest, longest restriction.

I would talk to your medical team about this. Even if they say it is fine, be careful with the size of bite and quantity. The stomach is the mechanical part of digestion and red meat is one of the toughest things to digest. 6 weeks is right at the time frame for lowering the risk of leaks, so, you are kinda on a tightrope there. BTW, I was about 5 months before trying red meat, but I was pretty conservative with my food progression.

!!RED FLAG ALERT!! You can't do this to yourself. If you were a bio major, then you know the body is going to hold on and release fluids all day long. It makes absolutely no sense to weigh yourself more than once a day. As was suggested above, stop weighing yourself. It will do you no good. Will the information the scale returns change how well you comply with your diet? What kind of a diet do they have you on? I was on a lean and green with Protein shakes for 2 weeks. My surgeon told me afterwards how I must have been compliant with the diet because my liver was so easy to work with. All you can do is your best. Ditch the scale altogether and just do the right thing. That is all you really can do, anyway.

You will get no restriction with liquids. This starts when you move to solid foods. With liquids, the pyloric valve easily opens and moves the liquids into the intestines soon after it enters the stomach. Don't worry, it will come. Just be sure not to drink fluids when you do start on solids.

You can create your own "exercise". Do a Google search on the topic of how many calories are burned and create your entry. Estimate on the low end, though is my suggestion. People tend to believe they exert far more effort in activities than they actually do. Just because you sweat a lot doesn't necessarily translate into real exertion. Same thing with entering foods. People often think their portion size is smaller than it actually is ... estimate your portion sizes larger.

Take a deep breath. Panic is not the solution. Knowledge is. First off, when you go on these diets pretty much everybody who complies loses the "quick 10" as this is your body burning through the glycogen stored in the liver. You are not burning fat (at least as much as you may believe you are) After this initial loss, you body must now turn to muscle and fat repositories converting them to glycogen for energy. This is a much slower process. So, you compliance is key and the reason why most people give up on diets after the first week as they stop seeing the "amazing" results. This is quite normal and should actually encourage you as you have moved from burning the stored glycogen to actually tapping fat and muscle. Stay with the Protein, though, so as not to lose too much muscle. How much weight do they want you to lose?

Yeah, 2 weeks out, it is impossible to hit 70-80 grams of Protein. Don't do the shots, either, as it is usually casein protein, which is OK before bed if you are power lifting, but is a slow absorber otherwise. Ensure you are hitting your liquid goals first as you can end up in the ER for dehydration, but not for lack of protein. Know what I mean? The protein goals will come.

Please share your solution as you are probably not the only one who may have this problem.

I lost a lot of muscle mass, but I tried to keep it to a minimum by being pretty diligent with my Protein intake both through natural sources and Protein drinks. I lifted a couple times a week, but my main concentration was aerobic exercise through running and HIIT. I know I lost a lot of muscle, but I would like to think it wasn't as bad as it could have been had I not done these things to ensure that when my body was going to be doing muscle repair, it had the protein available to do so. There is a whole exercise and fitness forum HERE.

I think it is up to the individual. At about the 6 month mark, people get to the stage where there sleeve can handle just about any type of food. They learn what foods will "slide" right through. It is strange feeling restriction after only a few bites. Pre-sleeve, our solution to this was to drink liquids to settle an uncomfortable stomach. Those who choose to ignore this guideline post-sleeve will have something to drink when this feeling comes and are able to consume more calories than the person who doesn't drink with their meals. So, I firmly believe that if you follow the guidelines of eating lean Protein first, chewing well and not drinking 15 minutes prior, during or 15 minutes after eating (and of course exercise), you can lose weight anytime you need to post-sleeve. Myself, I am almost 2 and a half years post-sleeve and have excellent restriction when I follow these guidelines. I know my slider foods and avoid them when I am looking to lose a few pounds. I'm sure you have seen it posted here several times that this is a surgery on our stomachs, not our heads. If a person doesn't face the issues as to why they got to being obese, the sleeve isn't going to change this behavior. If you want to abuse food post sleeve, you will be able to. The 6 month "honeymoon" is a time when it is too painful to do it, so this is the time when you need to face these demons and make the fundamental change with your relationship with food. If you are able to do this, then the honeymoon lasts forever.

I eat my whole yogurt, too. But not to throw the thread off topic, when did yogurt become so sugary? Have you compared the nutritional information on the back of these things? Some of them are worse than candy bars. But it's yogurt, so it's healthy ... right?

Can you be more precise? Are you using a mobile device or web browser? If from a mobile device, are you using the VST application or through a browser? When you respond to an existing thread, you are not seeing your response among the other responses? If so, are you sure you are hitting the Post button after typing your response? If you are not seeing responses other people are posting to threads you create, then, well ... you probably can't read this one, soo ... but check in your settings whether you are blocking people.

So, I just got back from a computer conference in Vegas for 5 days and I thought I would report on what it was like. For those who don't know me, I was sleeved 07/08/2011 and have been maintaining at goal since 03/2012. The conference supplied a continental Breakfast buffet everyday which consisted of: Fruit (melons, berries, pineapple), cereals, yogurt and about 7 different danish/roll type things. Oh, also had a variety of Odwalla juices and of course, coffee. lunch was a choice of two different meat dishes, one poultry and the other a beef item. One day was spaghetti and meatballs. The had a salad, bread rolls and two choices for vegetables. Again, this was buffet style. First off, those who read a lot around here might remember food was limitless and I wouldn't be able to abuse food the way I had before. I learned a lot about myself and the strength my sleeve gave me on that trip and I am happy to report I had no anxiety going to Vegas knowing that pretty much 67% of my meals were going to be from a buffet and I was going to be surrounded by a large percentage of people who were going to be eating quite large portions. So, for breakfast, I would take some fruit a yogurt and the yummiest looking danish thingy I saw. I would start with my yogurt because I knew that had the biggest nutritional impact of my choices. There was no way I was going to be able to eat all the fruit I took and I was able to have about two bites of the danish. I also took one of the Odwalla drinks ... the superfoods one with the spiralla (sp?) stuff in it. Since I was at a conference and breaks were few and far in-between (and I would spend most of that break time speaking to the presenter) I knew I did not have time to snack in between sessions, so I would be able to drink that and not make noise of opening a Protein bar or the like. Lunches were similar in that I would grab some salad, some veggies and each of the meat selections. Like suggested by the guidelines, I would eat the meat first having about 3 bites putting down my utensil after each bite and chewing well. The first day the server asked me wanted to drink and looked at me funny when I said, "Nothing, thanks!", so I would order a Water, but never drank from it. Besides ... it's water from Vegas ... have you ever tried that stuff? OY! Anyhew, after about 3 bites of meat, I would have a couple bites of salad (with the dressing) and a couple bites of veggies. All together, I would say about 10 bites and I was stuffed to the gills. I had no anxiety about the others stuffing themselves around me and was able to move on to the next session and NOT be in a food coma ... unlike a lot of my cohorts. At night, I went to fabulous restaurants: Emeril's (amazing chowder with half a roll and I had gumbo another night ... incredible) Hugo's Cellar (by far the best salad ... I've been going there for it for over 20 years, but had leftovers this time) and Wolfgang Puck's splitting a cheese burger (I removed the top bun and had a couple fries). I don't drink, but am in AA as a recovering alcoholic. I would have loved to have either met up with other WLS folks or gone to an AA meeting, but I simply had no time. Did a little bit of gambling and came home about $175 ahead. So, no anxiety about food and had a great time. No food or alcohol hangovers and had a great time with my fellow computer geeks. Shows me that life with the sleeve means so much MORE, not less. You can do this deal ... really.

All I can say is WOW! Wow.

Wow ... soooo ... a lot of harsh reactions here, for sure. Before posting something harsh, reflect on your own demons and struggles. Have you ever struggled with depression or had the feeling that you just didn't care what happens to you? The OP may be dealing with some depression. This is such a difficult thing as denial, rage, self-loathing, apathy and well, depression sets in. It can be difficult to see the forest for the trees. The denial of responsibility creates a vicious circle where the person spirals downward. Not recognizing this and seeking helps further aggravates the issues. To the OP, think about it. What is the worst thing that can happen if you reach out for help? What is the best thing that could happen? The truth lies somewhere in between, but it only starts when you reach out for help. You recognize this and have taken the first step by posting here. Take the next step.

Oy! This thread has trended in a direction I or Laura would be blamed for. Nice job Butter! Lol! Anyhow, you need to read the entire thread because there has been a dialog with the OP for which they have been responding to other people's posts and giving us more information. Information YOU need to make an informative response instead of, well ... I mean, come on ... the thread is over 3 pages ... don't you think there may be more to the story than just the first post?

I used to be so warm. Too warm, to be honest. My wife loved it, though. But, post-sleeve, I was so cold all the time. Even in the summer. I would say a little after a year, maybe 15 months post-op, this started to get better. Now, I am not as warm as I used to be, but I am not as cold as I was post-op either. A very happy middle ground I would like to think most "normal" people are at.

Self sabotage is a tricky thing. I know, that when I have the symptoms of HALT(Hungry, Angry, Lonely, Tired), I can sabotage myself without even realizing it. And not just food. It sounds like you may be following a similar path of the F*-its. I know this is going to come across as judgemental, but please know that it is not. I just don't have the literary skills to be as tactful as you (and other readers) may like, but know that my response is based in concern and love. You know the guidelines, but are ignoring them. You know you are not supposed to have liquids with meals, but alas ... Cereal with milk ... sure. You are going to be able to eat a ton of that because it is not going to sit in your stomach. But you know this ... and you still you cry that the sleeve is not working for you. Cookies with Water ... well ... what did you really expect? You have expectations for the sleeve which are not real. Everything you have heard about the sleeve is true, but what you did not listen to is that you are going to have to be a participant in this, too. The sleeve will help you move mountains, for sure, but you know what? You need to bring your own shovel, too. Sorry for the tough love, but if you really want this to work, then get to work. If you want change, then make a change.

Well, you are losing inches, right? Isn't that the bottom line? Are you wanting to lose fat, muscle or weight? THAT is the question we must ask ourselves ... Is it OK if we lose fat, but stay at the same weight? Is it OK if we lose muscle AND lose weight? Is it OK if we ... I know that right now ... for me ... I would be happy as all get out if I could gain 5 pounds of muscle. I think a lot of based on what our goals are and how well we understand WHAT exactly our body is doing.

As long as your consumption of calories is less than what you burn, you will lose. It will slow down over time as you get closer and closer to a "normal" BMI, but this will always hold true. Bottom line, if you don't follow the basic guidelines and consume the same number of calories as you burn, then yes, you will be done losing. Add exercise, follow the guidelines (eat lean Protein first, no drinking thing) and you will lose.

I was on the same diet. It took me until day 5/6 before I found my groove.

Sleeved on Friday, back half day on Wednesday, full time following Monday. Desk job.