PdxMan

So I have posted before about my co-worker who sits next to me. He is one of the exceptions. He is rail thin, about 5' 5", 130 pounds would be my guess. He eats all day long and I mean all day long. Gluten free, though, to note. So far this morning (11:00 am), I have seen him eat an entire can of peanuts (he eats at least one of these every day), a regular single server bag of sour patch kids, a banana and a Red Bull. He has a quart of homemade chili on his desk for lunch (I got him into doing that, but I have an 8 oz container compared to his 32 oz). Later, he will probably go to Subway and get one of their sandwich wedgies on the gluten free bread. I, by no means regard him as a "normal" eater as I said above, he is an exception. But I worry about others who have people like him in their lives and regard him as being normal. I know I can't eat like that and didn't eat like that in my hayday. There are people who can eat crap all day long and not be obese. It is important to remember that is not "normal" behavior.

OMG, Miracle Whip was my staple food (if it qualifies as being a food). My all time favorite with Velveeta (if it qualifies as being a food) and Miracle Whip. I had distended my stomach on many occassion with that combination. Food porn discussions are not a good thing for me. It gets my head spinning ... Seriously. I'm outta here.

Miracle Whip with potato chips on Wonder bread, here. Loved them. I had one of these just yesterday on fresh honey whole wheat rolls I made for Thanksgiving #1.

For me, things got to what I refer to comfortable in my earlier post at about the 6/7 month post op. That is when I was able to eat a few bites of meat and salads didn't leave my stomach going flippy floppy. Mind you, portions were still very small and I wasn't "eating around" my sleeve. For the most part, I was very compliant with the guidelines. I stopped eating BEFORE my new understanding of what full is. If you find that when you are past this point and you are questioning whether you have stretched your sleeve, first off, KNOW that it really isn't possible. What you are most likely experiencing is due to eating around your sleeve. I know that I can eat 8 oz of broth type Soups no problem. Just like I could pre-sleeve. It is like I never had the surgery. Have I been stretching my sleeve? No, my pyloric valve is able to open and move contents into the intestines before I finish. If I chew really well, I don't feel the discomfort if I had chewed well. Experiment with a Protein bar if you don't believe me. Eat half the bar the way you did pre-sleeve, large bites and not chewing as well. Commit how you feel to memory. Next day, eat the other half taking smaller bites and chew really well. Take a second before taking the next bite. Notice how you feel. Are you able to finish the bar? Is there any difference with how you felt the day before. Try this with other foods. Really, you can't stretch your sleeve the way some panicked pre or newly sleeved folk may be thinking. I truly believe it is a result of how and what we eat. If you don't believe me, experiment for yourself. That is what I did.

I hate to be the evil one here, but this is just one of the aspects of life that we all have to deal with now. We need to find ways of handling these situations because trust me, the rest of the world is not going to change just because I did. While I would love to believe it is all about me, the truth is, it isn't. One thing I learned from having kids is birthdays are not about me. My wife and I Celebrate our birthdays because our children enjoy the festivities. Every kid loves going to a birthday party. Just because those around us have aged 30 years doesn't change this. Now, when I am surrounded by food, whether it be at work or wherever, I feel empowered because I have the tools to be stronger than I was before. Before, I couldn't say no and I would overdo it. Now, I can pass or have just a small bite. When I see others enjoying to excess, I smile because I don't have to do that anymore. This is but a small hurdle I had to learn how to jump over in my journey to improving my relationship with food. Find the power your sleeve has given you and stand before that cake and laugh! BTW, Happy Birthday! ** Edit ** Sorry ... didn't see it was powder Room.

Yes, my surgeon likened it to a wallet. Here is how I play it in my head: When you get your new wallet, the credit cards, license, business cards and money fit tightly. Takes a bit of wriggling to get everything in. Then, when you sit, it is uncomfortable. You have to wiggle around to get comfortable. But, over time, as you pull the cards and money in and out, things begin to slip in easier. It molds to your butt and becomes comfortable. Now, later, after finding the wallet's capacity, if I try to stuff 10 business cards in it when I am at a conference or something, sure, it accommodates and is not comfortable to sit on again, but it is temporary, As soon as I get back to my hotel room and take out the cards, everything is back to its comfortable self and suffers no long term damage from stuffing those 10 business cards in. Now, if I stuff 10 business cards in everyday, then 15 ... then 20 ... over a long period of time, sure, it is going to be all out of whack, but whilst I was stuffing those cards, I sure would be uncomfortable doing it. I would know that I am trying to do something I should not be doing. Time to go to wallet-stuffers anonymous!

OK, I see how it is ... nice.

One large cup, here. At least 12 oz, but I didn't return to coffee until I was about a year out. As a matter of fact, I think it is ready right now.

Not sure if you are asking me, but yes, this was my surgeons pre-op diet.

What does your pre-op diet consist of? I was on a lean and green diet for 2 weeks. The first 5 or 6 days seemed impossilbly difficult, but then it gets easier as you realize you are a week away from your life-altering decision. The adrenaline gets going and things get easier. Good luck!

Oh yeah, the green bean casserole has butter in it. I, too, make everything from scratch. I also make croissant rolls, which ... yeah ... butter. I think the only thing on my table that doesn't have butter in it is the pumpkin pie and cranberrys.

Just gotta throw a funny Thanksgiving story in here. Two years ago we had some friends from the Philippines join us for their first Thanksgiving experience. When I cook Thanksgiving and Christmas meals, I do not hold back on the calories or fat. They were absolutely amazed at how much they enjoyed everything and so when they inquired about how everything was made, our conversation went like this: Them: The Turkey was so pretty, how did you do that? Me: Well, you start with some butter ... Them: How do you make the stuffing? Me: Well, you start with some butter ... Them: I loved those mashed potatoes, what do you add to them? Me: Well, you start with some butter ... Them: That gravy was excellent, how do you make it? Me: Well, you start with some butter ... Them: Is that toffee homemade? How do you make it? Me: Well, you start with some butter ... You get the picture ... Yeah, I am an enabler.

I am not going to cite any statistic or reports, as requested, as we have to remember a lot of studies are funded by entities who are looking to push something. Remember the studies stating tobacco was not addictive? Low and behold, it was discovered Phillip Morris funded them ... so ... be careful with studies you find. So, what I can do is relate my personal experience from being sleeved almost two and half years ago. I am not going to talk about my friend's sister's hairstylist who had a client who was banded and ... Anyhew, I was always ravenously hungry eating several meals a day snacking in between. I am one of those who has had the food obsession lifted. My surgeon said this was a possibility but my body would learn a new sense of being hungry. It has. I now feel what I can only describe as being nutritionally deficient. My body feels hungry, not my stomach, nor my head. Sure, I still look at a cookie and love everything about eating it. I still enjoy eating food, but I no longer plan my next meal while eating my current meal, as I used to do. I haven't thrown up once, but did get the slimes once. It was about 6 weeks post when I was on pain medication for another procedure and I ate part of a peach too quickly, too large of bites and didn't chew well enough. I just slipped right back to old habits, but as I said, I was medicated and not thinking. I had terrible reflux pre-sleeve. I had a hiatal hernia repaired during the sleeve surgery. Since then, I have taken two Tums only once. I had worked very late one night, came home ... ate something and went straight to bed. Got the burning in the throat and took two Tums to settle things. Two Tums in over two years ... I used to take two tums every two hours ... The metabolic switch is an interesting thing. Is it because of the sleeve ... hmmm ... I do believe it has happened for me, but I would tend to think it is more related to the fact that I now exercise a heck of a lot more and do more quality exercise. Pre-sleeve, I was never able to sustain my heart rate in the higher zones for a long period of time. But is that because I eat smaller meals more often, which, they say is something useful for a strong metabolism? Interesting thought, there. I don't know why, but I do know that my metabolism is through the roof compared to pre-sleeve life. Compliance to the guidelines for me early out was not a big deal as I underwent this surgery knowing this was my last chance to live a long, healthy life. My Dr was going to put my on all kinds of meds and I just knew in my heart of hearts that I just could not blow this chance. Was this a drastic step, you bet and I totally understand why someone wouldn't get sleeved because of this. But as Butter said, why would I need this portion of the stomach that was excised? I feared that if I was banded, I would find some way to sabotage myself, as I had on all of my other weight loss attempts, and either get the band removed or not get filled to the point where I was in my green zone. I have issues with food. I needed a permanent solution to protect me from myself. I am my own worst enemy when it comes to food. I did ask my Dr (PCP, not surgeon) about the risks of needing the portion which would be removed and she laughed saying I had a better chance of being in a serious car accident than needing the stomach. Even if I got cancer, why would I think that portion of the stomach wouldn't be affected anyway? Like Butter said, I knew obesity was killing me. I'm not so risk intolerant that I am ready to hole up in the house never going out. There are no foods I cannot eat now. I can enjoy everything I did before, just in smaller portions. I take take all medications and do take Vitamins ... just like a normal person! The sleeve has filled every expectation and then some. I could go on and on, but I think I have already ... Good luck to all researching WLS and I hope you make the right decision that is right for you.

I don't know if there was judging or not, but I know I'm sure confused ... I think the bottom line, though, is there has been a history of an unhealthy relationship with food. Would that be correct or oversimplifying? I think the posts asking why she needed the surgery if she doesn't eat that much were also confused by these statements I quoted. But as has been pointed out, what does eating too much really mean? As Butter and Cheri point out, and what other WLS patients with some time under their belt discover, the body truly requires far less food than I ever imagined. We are all different. We have different health issues and take different medications. All these leave can leave our metabolisms messed up and those who have limited activity have these issues compound. The guy who sits next to me eats non-stop at his desk. I'm not kidding. The dude never stops eating. He is a rail while the guy across from me rides his bike into work everyday 10 miles each way. Rides on the weekends. He has his lunch which is always healthy portions and type, yet he is morbidly obese. Now, is this a front he puts up and goes home and binges on crap all night? Perhaps, but I doubt it. How can the person next to me eat no less than 4,000 calories a day and be a rail while the guy across seems to do everything right, yet is morbidly obese? So, overeating, IMO, is consuming more than your body needs to fuel itself while maintaining a proper metabolism. Finding that balance is the key. The sleeve has helped me do that. Not eating is not part of that equation as it throws your metabolism off. I do believe my mind is a scary place to be and to trust myself, early out, would be a practice in sabotage. I could not trust myself to make the right decisions. I needed help.

I'm not sure how to do it from the mobile app, but from a browser, if you click on your name, a little box shows up. At the top, there is a text entry control where you can put in text, then hit Update. You have just updated your status and voila! You show up on the side panel. Click on any user will also show their status as you are viewing there profile. It is not something for debate ... it is what it is. You can always send them a PM if you would like to communicate with them.

See, I think BtB see eye to eye here. I believe a lot of people would think, "Woa! What a cheater!" And his line, "Jeezus I'm Telling on myself", is unnecessary, for me. I don't call this cheating, I call it living. Now, you have to keep it in context. Butter reached goal a long time ago and is in maintenance mode. If this were the post of someone 4 months post-op and is crying about not being able to lose weight, well ... my post would take a different track. Perhaps I am trying to justify my own demons, I don't know ... because I am sitting here typing this while eating a Coffee Crisp (Canadians are so lucky) whilst drinking a chocolate mocha coffee made with half and half. But, I too, am at goal and have been for over a year and a half. Do I consider this a cheat? Heck NO! (Can't find a good swear word that ends in ED here ) I am back to exercising and for the most part, I follow the guidelines pretty closely. But these Coffee Crisps were sent from mephistopheles himself. I have one of these a week. What I do consider cheating, though, is when I eat for the reasons we have been chatting about here recently. When I eat not because I am hungry, but when I am eating just for the sake of eating. When I am looking to be comforted or feel justified in making poor choices. Thank you Misty for your intimate share. Very brave. Just know that your share has helped more people than you can imagine. As the old saying goes, God can move mountains, but bring a shovel. We are all works in progress, so I wanted to congratulate you on picking up your shovel.

That is the thing that kills me in AA. The folks who have been sober for a few years all get together and talk **** about the person struggling to stay in the program. Time away from the days when they abused has given them amnesia. I say to them, "If it is so easy, why did you struggle to get sober? Why couldn't you do it on your own?" Then, trying to get at the root of the addiction takes a lot of strength, but it, too, sometimes gets forgotten over time. Forgetting where I came from is a dangerous thing for me. For food and alcohol. When I can't understand other's struggles, I forget my own and my ego gets the best of me. I don't always need to know why a person struggles (though I like to), but I just have to be present to share my experience, strength and hope. That is the tenet of the 12th step and helps keep me sober, and that is why I participate here. Sharing my story reminds me of where I came from and where I am now. Thank you, GG, and to all who stay and share their story.

Oh, I totally agree men and women get overweight differently. That is one of the reasons why I was asking. Probably my own interpretation, but the whole thought of not understanding why people can't walk away from food would seem to indicate something else going on. But perhaps you can understand this phenomenon more than you let on in your earlier post ...? Maybe? You said yourself you had difficulty passing on cake or those evil little chocolate Little Debbie type things ... right? Is it a large leap to understand that other folks may have the same demons as it relates to other foods? Again, please don't interpret this as judging. You know I'm not the best at massaging things into warm and fuzzy posts, but I am honestly curious about how this works as I also see this in my other 12 step program and am trying to understand this better.

Cowgirl, you sound a lot like me, except for the whole post menopausal thing. I think the only times I ate to the point of pain was Thanksgiving/Christmas, otherwise, I never ate to the point of pain, I just ate often and snacked in between those times. My appetite would be insatiable. After finishing lunch, my thoughts would turn to, "What's for dinner?" If I was bored, I would eat. I would eat to celebrate, I would eat when I was sad. I always had an excuse as to why I was overweight. And just like you said, CGJ, I am amazed at not only that I survive on how much I eat, but actually THRIVE! My mother just shakes her head when she eats with me. "How can you live on so little?" I just tell her, "It shows you how little your body actually needs." I think this is just so true. And this may be one of the things that differentiates "normal" BMI folks who can eat what seems like a lot of food. People may eat 2,000 calories, but does that necessarily mean my body absorbs 2,000 calories? Could it be a "normal" person with a "normal" BMI merely absorbs fewer calories passing the rest? I don't know, but what I do know is that I did not have a healthy relationship with food. There is no denying that. But now ... don't let me kid myself ... I still have issues. But the sleeve helps me mitigate those issues better than I could before.

Wow! Thank you so much for sharing. Your story is a little bit of mine, too, and I'm sure many others can relate. I, too, was (am) a carb addict. It did cause additional hunger for me and my answer was to satiate that with additional carbs. I was a snacker ... big time. Peanut butter and crackers trembled when they entered my home because they knew their time on the shelf was going to be short. And it was. But quantity was also one of my issues. I would easily be over 3,000 calories daily if I honestly added up everything I ate. (snacks don't really count towards calories, do they?) One of the most valuable things I have gained from this journey, now almost 2 and a half years out is a better understanding of how I became morbidly obese and my poor relationship with food. I believe this to be one of the blessings of this procedure which I never knew about. It is my opinion that those who struggle turn a blind eye to confronting these demons and deny their existence. It is difficult for sure, but a necessary part of my journey. Thanks again for sharing!

For me, I cannot eat to "insane" levels, as I did before. I made poor choices and was not able to get up from the table until my plate was clean. I am a person who loves the feeling of being full. This was true pre-sleeve and is still true today. This is one of the primary reasons I got sleeved, to get that feeling with so much less volume. Also, now, with such a small amount of volume, I know I have to get the best bang for my buck, so what I do choose to eat usually is of a much healthier nature. But I totally understand the person who can't walk away from the plate of Cookies or who must finish the entire plate of baked halibut with asparagus. (Healthy meals) IMO, food does something else for them besides meet nutritional needs. That was true for me and I am wanting to learn what some of the other underlying issues may be.

I have a question for GG and Cheri, and please don't interpret my question as judging or saying anything negative. I'm just curious about your background and am summarizing here. You both mentioned you don't understand why people can't walk away from food, so I am curious as to how you came to choosing a bariatric procedure. I know for me, if it were as simple as choosing not to abuse food, I would have never needed WLS ... I would have merely chose not to overeat or make poor choices. Unfortunately, I tend to believe other folks who have WLS have a similar background as myself, so I am curious as to your story. I know I am asking a very personal question here, so please do not feel compelled to answer if you don't want to. Again, I am not judging you in as much as I am judging myself for making a poor assumption.

You (and others who posted the same) are absolutely correct about the mis-information. That is why I posted the suggestion for those researching VSG to explore the threads over in the Sleeve forums. As was pointed out, I think each WLS group has their opinions of the other WLS options partially based in fear which skews the truth. But, IMO, I would caution regarding your own doctor as the best person to ask questions regarding WLS. Most doctors are going to give advice on what they know, which, sounds reasonable ... right? But, therein lies the problem. How can they give advice about something they have never researched? My PCP is the top doctor at the clinic (over 100 doctors total) and he gave me the "eat less and exercise more". Yeah, been there, done that a hundred times. So, I went to seminar on WLS. The top surgeon here in Portland, Emma Patterson. She is pushing the RnY procedure ... hard. She gave the old, "Gold Standard" in bariatric procedures and so much history to go on. Again, I was like, "Yes, there is a lot of history on RnY, but, it isn't good history ... IMO." It was a procedure she had done many times and knew it well, so she is going to push it. No, at the time of my seminar, almost 3 years ago, there wasn't nearly as much VSG history, but what was there was very good and not to be ignored. After all, rotary phones were the gold standard for a very long time, too ... then touch tone phones, then ... The bottom line is everybody has to do what they feel comfortable with for their own story. Nobody should tell anybody what to do, with the exception of telling them to do a thorough research on WLS. I have gotten more bad advice from doctors than good, so, remember, doctors are fallible people, just like the rest of us. They are not gods. Use them as 1 resource. Don't be skewed by unreasonable fear. Every procedure has risks. Walking to a restaurant has risks, too, as I point out in my post earlier on this thread. We all have to decide what is reasonable and what our tolerance for risk is. We need to right-size this risk, too. How many other things in life have a 1 in 10,000 chance of occurring and am I willing to stop doing those things, too, because I am risk-intolerant? I'm not judging, I'm just saying ...

Wow ... this is such a difficult question to answer. Surely you know there is not just one answer. I can only relate my own experience. I think the biggest thing to point out, though, is my pre-sleeve expectations and my post-sleeve reality were miles apart. I've had emotional turmoil as I have confronted my issues relating to abusing food. The denial of the circumstances which led to a life of morbid obesity. Then, as I entered into the world of "normal" BMI, dealing with the changes in how people treat you ... and then how I reacted to other morbidly obese people ... It's a crazy journey, for sure. Add to it all the hormones which are stored in your fat getting released ... losing hair ... I could go on and on ... My emotions, outlook, self-view ... everything was a wild roller coaster ride. I'm about 2 and half years out and I believe things have settled in, but the old stinkin' thinkin' can come up at a moments notice. That is when it is so nice to have the sleeve to help keep me in check. I hope my experience helps, but this is just a vast, personal question where everyone is going to have their own experience.