missmeow

Not really. A normal stomach is 6-8 cups, so 2 cups is 1/4th to 1/3rd of a normal stomach. It would not be a large stomach by any stretch. *shrug* You know, someone having concerns about the current state of the procedure doesn't negate anyone's choice to have it done.

If they did 2 cup capacity at 1 year out, I would be on board. It seems the push is for 1 cup max now. That makes me not so on board.

I am really confused as to which part of my post this is in respose to? I am not trying to be rude but I do not see how any of that connects to any of the points I made. It is also frustrating to see this type of response as a catch-all, kind of response pop up in every other thread. Also, there is no "GUARANTEE" of anything in life. A lot, if not most, people start having health problems at that age of all shapes, sizes, and colors. My mom is fit, healthy, heavy into fitness and got breast cancer in her early 50s. In fact, most of the thin people on that side of the family died young. The people who were built like refrigerators? Lived to be old and all of them were active. Obviously, the heavier you are, the more likely you are to have problems and it certainly isn't healthy to be morbidly obese. Likewise, losing weight does not guarantee that you will not get diabetes, cancer, or heart disease. Thank you for the response. In researching the background for gastrectomy, the majority of the artices were based on the Bilroth I/II and it appears that most of the cancers are lower in the stomach. This certainly points me to the right direction in looking for more information. Like I said, I am on the fence and just sharing some of the thoughts I am having, which is to answer the OP.

Urine should be clear or light yellow if you are fully hydrated. It gets darker as you dehyrate, which will give you nausea, headaches and maybe even the poops. Vitamins usually turn mine this funky bright yellow with a tinge of green, like flourescenty? It's weird. But for others its more of a darker yellow. I would say try to drink more water.

I'm still on the fence. I haven't made up my mind for myself. Everyone has to make their own decision but I am right where the OP is. The fact is, no one knows for sure what the long term results will be. We can guess they will be good, as the 6 year results are showing a 50% weight loss compared to 70% at 3 years, which is as good if not better than RNY without all the rerouting. 50% is still much more than anyone would lose and keep off for 5 years with diet and exercise. If the average sleever has 100lbs to lose, 50lbs is enough to get someone from morbidly obese to simply obese or even overweight. So the weight related health issues should be negated. (I have to confess that I do not believe the BMI is a good measure of health and some people can carry more weight than others without health consequences. So even if they are overweight or even obese, currently about 30lbs over ideal weight, they can still be perfectly healthy long term.) There have been cases of people with nutritional deficiencies and reading this board, short term memory might be an issue too. The thing I get stuck on is that bariatric surgery has a horrible history when it comes to end results, quality of life and longevity. Part of that is due to the relative health of many of the patients. Another part is the surgeries themselves (JIB, VBG). The lapband was heralded as the most awesome thing ever but now, 10 years out, people now know it isn't so great and it is not a life-time solution. Many of the people here are here because their band failed in as little as 6 months. That is terrible when you think about it. Why wouldn't a bandster question the sleeve? The band failed, the sleeve might too and once it's gone, it's gone. For those who have made the choice to do it, more power to them. I applaud anyone who is definitive in their choices and sticks with it. Reading your posts certainly encourages me to go through with it because so many of you are doing great. But I'm otherwise healthy and looking at a solid 35, 40, 50 years ahead, life with only 15% of my stomach intact and the potential for long term nutrient deficiencies, memory loss, etc is something not to be jumped into lightly, kwim? I think this is the headspace the OP is sitting in. It is where I am right now. One day, I am like, I am going for it, I am IN! The next day, I am like, no way am I going there. The plusses to the surgery are that the pylorus is still intact, so at least the stomach does do its normal job which is totally different than a regular gastrectomy. It does annoy me a bit that people compare the two when the comparison is not exactly the same. The other thing is that a gastrectomy for cancer, where sucess is measured by surviving 5 years, is such a completely different set of factors than an elective surgery for weight loss. I know there are many people who have no stomach at all and are living, but then the quality of life issue pops up. It's one thing when it is done for survival and another when it is done for essentially for vanity (in my case it would be). Of course, is quality of life that great as a fat person? Some would say no, not at all. I wish there was an inbetween the band and sleeve. They have the endolumial barrier that is showing good results but only in the experimental phase, which means another 5 years. I don't want to wait that long. I wish there was a choice in size. Not because my "fat head" wants to eat but because I feel it would mitigate some of the potential nutritional issues long term. I would rather revise later than be stuck. Sorry for the livejournal post but it's helping me work my head around somethings.

That is not the case. The vertical banded gastroplasty is stomach stapling where they created a pouch more similar to a RNY by stapling horizontal. The stomach was not resected. This surgery has been completely abandoned because a) people regained the weight and it was dangerous and a lot of people died or had kidney/liver failure. Even gastrectomies done for cancer/ulcer are different than the sleeve. Those are Billroth I/II or RNY and the top part of the stomach is typically left behind and the bottom part and pylorus goes. So even that is not really comparable except for the fact that a portion of the stomach is removed.

How much was it on the standard? I did not sign up for basic because I did not see the surgeon on their list of doctors? ergh.

If you're eating under 50% of your required daily intake to maintain your current body weight, you pretty much hit a semi-starvation state. The large amount of protein is needed to preserve your muscle mass so that your body gets all the protein and amino acids it needs from your food and not your muscles.

Well, if someone was talking like that about you, would you want to be with them? Probably not. Because everyone deserves to be with someone who loves them and not someone who sticks around because they think or thought they couldn't do better or likes their company. You have friends to keep you company. A partner needs to be something more than that. So find yourself someone who you can really love and be partners with and let him do the same.

Removing a large portion of your stomach is extreme and comes with potential health hazzards of its own. Having to go the extreme of injury to healthy organ tissue and a diet of under 1000 calories just to mobilize fat loss that would happen in a normal sized person with moderate diet and exercise changes should be indication of how complex obesity is phisiologically. Even with surgery, long term results are not 100% for weight loss even at the 50% EWL mark, especially when you look at all bariatric surgery historically. Not everyone is willing or wants to do that or can do that due to their health, finances, personal beliefs, etc. You can change your sex with surgery too. You can also modify your looks with surgery, makeup, and hair dye enough to be seen as another race. Religion is a protected class and it is completely voluntary so saying "you can change being fat" does not really hold Water, especially when diets fail 95% of the time. My point is that saying "those fatties can stop eating" when you were unable to do so is buying into the exact line of thinking of the discriminators. Someone should not be forced into surgery in order to get a job or keep a job. Obesity, particularly morbid obesity, is a much more complex phisiological issue than just someone eating twinkies all day. You as a fat person should know better.

You don't see the irony in the "no one shoved a twinkie down your throat" comment coming from someone who had 80%+ of their stomach removed to lose weight? The issue isn't free speech. It is whether or not an employer has the right to discriminate against you because of your size. If you are capable of doing your job, as many of you were prior to surgery, then why should you risk getting fired because you get a new boss who decides they don't like fat people? In an ideal world you get the job because you have the skills and abilities to do it.

Anorexia nervosa is a psychological disorder in which certain criteria have to be met in order to be diagnosed with it (including a BMI under 18, IIRC). Now if you lost all of your weight and ate a restrictive diet and met all of the other criteria of anorexia nervosa, then yes, you could be diagnosed as having anorexia nervosa. Just eating low calories in and of itself is not anorexia nervosa, especially when it is a medically monitored restriction. Obese individuals have a lot of body fat. Our bodies have evolved to store fat and the burn it during times of calorie restriction. Us obese individuals are like the x-men of fat storage In any case, the body burns fat to get its energy. The doctors use the high Protein diet to ensure that what we do eat is providing enough protein and amino acids so that our bodies don't burn muscle too (although some level of muscle loss happens, obese indivudals usually have higher muscle mass to begin with from carrying the extra weight). Anorexia as a word is just as a general term just means loss of appetite. In that sense, the post-operative healing period is a surgically induced anorexia (loss of appetite). Once the stomach has healed and the swelling goes down, the calorie counts can go up and appetite returns even if it is not at the same level as pre-op. IMO, its that post-operative period where the "magic" happens. There is little desire or ability to eat, so eating on the restrictive diet plan is much easier to accomplish compared to just sticking to the same diet without the surgery. That's why they push for you to be at or near goal at 6-12 months. It seems that 6-12 period is where the stomach completely heals, people are having more of a desire to eat, and people have learned to eat with their new stomachs so it becomes harder to meet the goal. That's just my opinion though.

Whenever people dramatically change themselves, other people are going to comment. People comment on all kinds of random stuff. Most of the time, your brain filters the innane clutter and you move on...until someone hits a hot button. We can either choose to waste our energy on other people, or choose to get to the root of why certain topics elicit an emotional response. If this is a hot button issue, you're going to waste a lot of time and energy frustrated by other people's commentary. I used to get that same response about my feet. Then I figured out why it was such a hot button and now it doesn't bother me. (I have club feet that have been surgically repaired as a child but they aren't "normal" or "pretty" looking feet)

I haven't made up my mind yet. I have been losing slowly and haven't been super active/motivated on it but it has been coming off. I am inbetween potential long-term risks of the surgery vs. potentially short-term benefits (i.e. potentially being thin for a short term period at the long term risk of vitamin deficiencies). Now, before someone jumps in, the 6 year data is showing 70% EWL at year 2 and as low as 50% EWL at year 6. 50% is still 50lbs for a 100lbs need, so not bad, but is that worth it, especially if I can get to that point on my own? That's where I start flip-flopping. My real desire is for a larger sleeve (like 2 cups or 70% of stomach) with the potential for revision. I just feel that would stave off a lot of issues but the surgeons seem fixated on less and less stomach. I don't want to end up with no stomach or RNY if something does go wrong 20 years from now. Vertical banded gastroplasty was the sleeve of the 70s/80s and a lot of those ended up reversed with people having serious health issues. I don't want to end up in that category with nowhere else to go. Sorry to be a downer, but these are my real thoughts.

There is nothing that says you have to do it now, right? So if you're that scared and aren't ready, taking some time to sort it out isn't going to hurt you. You should be 100% ready for any surgery that is voluntary. Maybe talk to your surgeon again and see if it helps.

Well, try to put yourself in their shoes. Your getting surgery and losing weight may affect them in that they feel that you have rejected your fatness in favor of surgery and now you may reject them too because they are fat. I think it has more to do with feeling a little dumped on than jealousy. Like, "oh now she is going to be thin like other people and start judging me too" fear creeping up.

What about the 1-5 years before that? I would think if you can show a history of BMI over 40 with one year of attempted weight loss (and failed due to weight regain) you would be able to appeal it.

I am in the same waffling category as you, except that I am 35. I have no health problems and have already lost a bit of weight on my own without a huge amount of stress. I keep waffling between really giving it a go and getting to an "overweight" I can live with because I know the chances of me losing 75-100lbs and keeping it off are 95-99% against me doing so, or going through the surgery and being able to fit into pants I haven't fit into for over 10 years. Some would say that if I haven't done it already, I'm not ever going to do it. I would say that may not be the case. I have not really confronted a lot of the issues and reasons for keeping weight on (other than my fantastic crappy metabolism) and self-sabotaging. Going through this process has really put me in touch with the issues I have to deal with in order to move forward, especially if I go through with the surgery. I am some days thinking, if I can conquer that, then I should be able to do it on my own. Other days, I think no fxing way. So I do totally understand where you are coming from and don't want to be a debbie downer. I just want to throw it out there that you aren't alone and I think everyone on here goes through some level of self-doubt and what-ifs. Only you can weight the potential negatives with the positives and determine if it comes out a winner. (edited: I can post my concerns/issues elsewhere, just wanting to keep it positive)

I wish you the best of luck in finding a way to surgery. In the meantime, there is nothing stopping you from making the changes you'll need to make with the surgery now I've been doing to same in order to get myself into the mindset and I haven't even gotten to the "supervised diet" portion of my wait, but have been losing. Nothing wrong with trying

No one went to UCI?

No, I would never have considered a bypass/RNY. Even though the death rates have gotten better, they are still bad. It also is a pretty horrible surgery frankly. I would rather be fat forever than do that to myself. At least I am healthy. I cannot say the same for so many who have gone through that. Malabsorption just really squicks me out to the core. I started wanting a band but the surgeon's office was pushing the sleeve and started looking into it. I am going through the motions and some days I am ready to go and others I am so not convinced. For me, I have to get control of the rollercoaster.

I know this is heresy, but have you tried upping your calories for a week? Sometimes in a stall, upping the calories and then dropping them back down kind of gives your metabolism a kick in the pants to start up again. Otherwise, talk to your doc/nutritionist and see what can be causing you to hold on to your weight. With all the weight loss maybe something hormonal is going on that needs checking into.

I am going to answer this from the opposite perspective. I was normal sized until I gained a lot of weight rapidly. It took me, gosh, 3-5 years for my dreams (where my real self image resides) to catch up with this. I would dream I was my normal size and my normal self. Waking, I knew I was big and once I got on the scale and saw photos, I knew it for sure. So if you have been big all your life, or most of your life, it is probably going to take awhile for your brain to catch up. I would say it is perfectly normal and it would also be perfectly normal to need some help adjusting.

I have been "thinking" about WLS for about 1 year. Last year I did a pretty restrictive diet and inbetween ate normally. I lost close to 40lbs without a whole lot of effort (gained the holiday 10, but that is almost officially off too). I am 35 and don't want to wait until I am 45. I went into my surgical consult last month convinced to get the band. However, they seemed real keen on the VSG and saying without saying not so much on the band. So I have been reading both. I am fat, but I have no health problems related to weight. My blood pressure is good (105-117/65-80 on average). My cholesterol is good, triglycerides are good, my HDL is good. My blood sugar is excellent and no diabetes in the family. I am able to stick to a diet for awhile, but when I go off, I go off and then have big motivation problems getting back on. I do best on a high Protein, low carb diet so this sounds like a good match. My tendency is to be very black and white in my eating patterns. If I am not on a diet, then I am being "bad" and if I am at a restaraunt, then I order what I want to eat. I am trying again to reroute my mind into middle ground that yes I can have Cookies, but that doesn't mean because I had cookies, I need to eat chips to round out the badness. I can just have the cookies and still be good. So I am *working* hard on changing my thought patterns. I was normal sized up until my early 20s when I was first put on birth control pills. I had a slight weight gain then. But then they changed my pills and I ballooned up. Combine rapid weight gain with a "damn I'm gross, eff it I'm eating Burger King morning, noon, and night!" attitude after I gained about 60lbs in about 6 months or so, I continued to pack on the pounds year after year. From my lowest weight of 118, my old "set point" of 125, to at my highest recorded of 252. OMG. So basically, there are many elements of this surgery that I like. I like that after time you can still eat all of your favorite stuff, just a few bites instead of a full serving or two. I like that there is no foreign body to have to work around or ports to get infected or the nearly 100% chance the band will have to come out within the next 5-10 years. What I don't like is the lack of long term data. What happens to me in 10, 20, 30 years? Will long term nutritional deficiences cause me problems? Is this surgery going to shorten my life? Because it can. There is absolutely no guarantee being fat will since we have some chunkers in my family who have lived to ripe old ages (although I would need to lose and keep off about another 30-40lbs in order to be where they were). I also don't like that it is permanant and that if anything goes wrong with the staple line, or my stomach explodes, I am stuck in some sort of bypass situation which is something I DO NOT want. In fact that is my biggest fear. The other part of the permanent thing is the lack of control. I can't get my stomach back but a band can be removed. So I am still in the driver's seat. I am also a bit scared of the rapid weight loss. I'd prefer to lose a steady 5-10lbs/month than huge 30lbs drops that I am seeing on the boards. Crazy, I know! But I am weird :tongue2: The VBG was popular and people who were a few years out raved about it. But it is now considered a very dangerous surgery by the AMA according to the wiki. Liver and kidney failure were common with that one. Bypass patients seem to end up with heart attacks. I know it may sound dramatic but it is very real to me trying to make this decision. Many of the people posting on this board had serious weight related health issues and mobility issues, so the choice is much easier to make, at least in my mind. Hands down, if I had diabetes, could barely walk, and/or was on a million pills a day to keep me alive, I would do it ini a heartbeat. But was anyone healthy but fat and made this choice? What brought you to the decision?

I've always had that reaction to the show!!! I watch it like a trainwreck if I can stomach it. It's like OMG HE ATE THAT OMG OMG WHY WHY WHY! I literally get sick to my stomach. I'm like agggh stop!