Cleo's Mom

@@Band07 Thanks for the information. Good luck to you with your surgery. You sure have been through a lot.

I'm SO sorry to hear about your husband, that must have been terrible for you.Yes, I'm sure my dilated esophagus was from keeping the band too tight for so many years. I hate that Iv gained weight but I don't miss the band at all. Have you looked into the MGB ? I never ever thought I would consider it but I haven't read a single negative thing about it .. Thank you. Losing my husband was the heartbreak of my life and even after 10 years it is enormously painful. The medical community failed him at every point. He had a fundoplication when he was 32 and that failed (it was major open surgery then, not laproscopic) and when PPI's came out he went right on them, but it didn't stop the damage. Is there a good site to get information about the MGB? I worry about absorption of Vitamins and minerals. And dumping. I take several prescription drugs - the most important being Synthroid. And I don't like the idea of taking constipating Iron for life. My surgeon said I could lose as much as 45 pounds with the sleeve. I'm not sure I want to go through everything for that. I am under 200 lbs. now. Additionally, nothing medically improved when I lost weight with the band - particularly my chronic back problems which actually got worse. It is my back and not my weight that limits what I can do in life. Are you still considering the MGB? Thanks for your reply.

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I'm an apple shape and no amount of weight loss will change that. Even when I weighed 122 lbs, it was my waist that was a problem. Buying pants that fit at waist and not baggy at hips has been a problem for me at every weight from 122 lbs. to 250 lbs. Hips, thighs - not a problem. Stomach - big problem. Body shape, to a large degree, is genetic.

@@Band07 Was your esophagus dilated because of having a tight band? My most recent upper GI (February) showed that my band is in place, everything looks okay, slight esophageal dysmotility. I can eat most anything (bread is still sometimes a problem) but must eat slowly, don't drink at meals and sometimes still get pressure, pain and left shoulder pain. I always have concern about increased GERD and Barrett's esophagus with the sleeve and band. Though the risk is small going from Barrett's to esophageal cancer - it still is a difficult cancer to treat. My husband, who didn't have WLS, suffered from GERD, then Barrett's and had yearly endoscopies in a "wait and see" approach. He went from NO dysplasia one year to esophageal cancer the next. Clearly the "wait and see" approach is a failed method. They removed his esophagus, pulled up his stomach to make a new one, had no node involvement but 11 months later it was in his liver and terminal. He died the following year at a young age. I remember my second doctor (I left my first doctor who was an idiot*) said that so many of his patients kept asking for more and more fill to lose weight with the band. That is a very bad decision anatomically and medically. Causes too many problems long term. *you can read about this on this forum about my weight loss journey.

I've been following your posts and I thank you for a new perspective. There are those on all 3 WLS forums who swear by their procedure and are happy as clams. Your posts is a stark reminder that not all WLS works the same for all people. Just go to the complication forums for each. There are no guarantees. I have an unfilled band (got in 2008, unfilled in 2009), was considering the sleeve but decided against it for many reasons. I hate my band and hated it from the beginning. It never did one thing for me in terms of weight loss, reaching satiety, but it did cause shoulder pain, pressure & pain and getting stuck. When you get WLS it is a crap shoot. Will you be the one who says - it was a breeze, little pain, losing weight fast, everything's great? Or the one who says - I have a leak, am in the hospital with abscess, on IV feeding, or I have chronic constipation or diarrhea or worsening GERD. For those who have amazing results, see 100 or more pounds lost, comorbidities disappear - they are willing to put up with the problems or side effects. Their life has improved more than it has deteriorated. I am 64, the surgeon says I could lose up to 45 pounds with the sleeve but there would be no NSAIDS for life (I have arthritis and chronic back problems) with possible increased GERD. I don't believe the benefits outweigh the risks in my case. I, too, would never suggest the band to anyone. I always hated mine. But I also wouldn't give a blanket endorsement to the sleeve. It is still new and remember when everyone was big on the band before we knew then what we know now? Who is to say what the long term case is with the sleeve? I think your post shows that there are always two sides to WLS and they aren't always both good.

I am so sorry you have had such a terrible complication but your post, I think, can serve as a reminder that no surgery, including weight loss surgery, is without its risks and complications, some life threatening. I hope you have a speedy and total recovery. Good luck to you.

@@Tkrk0325 I am very sorry for the loss of your father, too. Esophageal cancer is a very difficult cancer to treat. My husband's was caught early and they removed his esophagus and pulled up his stomach to create a new one. No lymph node involvement. We all thought he had dodged the bullet. But eleven months later it had spread to his liver. It was terminal. There are some on here who have Barrett's who are getting the sleeve and the surgeon is willing to do it. I think that is a mistake, even if the chances of getting esophageal cancer are slim, if you are the one who gets it, the odds are little comfort. Thanks for your reply and good luck with your sleeve and weight loss. @@VSGAnn2014 Thank you for all the information and links. I am aware of all the complications the band can produce and the reasons for removal. However, I still don't think it has been promoted as temporary in and of itself - barring any of those complications. But as any device, it can break and need to be replaced or removed. The tubing can dislodge, the port can flip, etc. And in that respect THAT particular band would be temporary, but I don't think in general it was manufactured, or sold or promoted as being a temporary weight loss device with the need for removal/replacement in everyone in X number of years.

I think anything that increases your risk of GERD could increase your risk of Barrett's and therefore esophageal cancer, even though the risk is small. My husband (no WLS) had GERD, then Barrett's and was receiving yearly endoscopies. He went from one year of NO dysplasia to esophageal cancer then next. The "wait and see" approach for monitoring the Barrett's didn't work. My husband died 2 years later. That is why I get so concerned when someone who has Barrett's is considering the sleeve.

I posted the question about whether the lap band was presented as being a permanent fixture in the lap band forum and no one has said they were told anything other than it was permanent but reversible. If what you are saying is true then EVERY lap band patient has been not only misled but lied to. Why hasn't there been some huge class action lawsuit especially in light of the problems many band patients face? Why would anyone go through all of the difficult and painful WLS journey to get something that was only temporary and therefore would put you back at square one sometime in the future? I've had the band for almost 7 years, have had several endoscopies and upper GI's. They all looked normal, except for small hiatal hernia. I would think that endoscopies, in particular, can evaluate any damage or problems with the band.

And how many people develop an autoimmune disease that didn't have the lap band? There would have to be research and studies on this topic to show a cause and effect - comparing those in the general population without WLS in the vulnerable age groups for these autoimmune diseases against the same group who have had the band. Then the differences would have to be statistically significant to conclude a cause and effect excluding other factors such as genetics, etc. I am no fan of the band, that is for sure, but if you go to the lap band forum you will see many who are, just like you see all those who just love the sleeve on here.

I think what Allergan is saying is that it is a solid device and therefore can break just like any other device if not handled properly or that some people can have an allergic or adverse reaction to the band. But I think that when they put it in people absent any of these factors - it is meant to be permanent. If this information is given to surgeons, why aren't they telling lap band patients that it will need to be removed in the future? Because they aren't telling them that. Who would get it done with that information? No one knows what they will be saying about the VSG sometime in the future - more GERD, more Barrett's, more esophageal cancer? No one predicted all the problems with the lap band when it was popular.

I am 64 years old and started my weight loss journey over 10 years ago, when my husband was still alive (he will dead 10 years this fall). I started with the pre-op testing, etc.. but as his health failed I couldn't take part in the demanding schedule so I gave it up. Two years after he died (2007) I started the process again, but this time at a local hospital with a local surgeon because I would have to do all the driving to all the appointments and I didn't want to drive into the city at the university hospital. MISTAKE NUMBER ONE. This surgeon and his partner were new to bariatric surgery. They were general surgeons who took over the practice of a retiring surgeon. My theory is that they were going to use up the existing inventory first, which is why he put in an outdated 4cc band. MISTAKE NUMBER TWO.* I was only his 23rd patient and while his surgical skills were okay, his knowledge about the complexities of obesity as a disease were nil. MISTAKE NUMBER THREE.* I had already lost 60 pounds on my own prior to and right after surgery - 6 months of dieting and 2 weeks pre and 2 weeks post surgery - liquids only. But still he wanted me to lose 10-15 pounds in 3 weeks with no fill. MISTAKE NUMBER FOUR.* When I didn't - I got the "Come to Jesus talk". He had told me I had the 10cc band. So, when he filled me with 3cc I couldn't understand why I was having so many problems. I couldn't keep anything down. He was blaming me, telling me to do this, not do that, blah, blah, blah. I was thinking - Why would 3cc cause so many problems in a 10cc band? So he ordered an upper GI which showed not much was going through. When he got the results of the upper GI- THAT GOT HIS ATTENTION!!!! He called me in immediately and removed 1.5 cc. MISTAKE NUMBER FIVE.* It was then that I asked for all my test results and operative report that I had sent to another doctor for a second opinion. He was the one who told me I had a 4cc band, it had slightly slipped and my weight loss in 6 months was what is expected in a year. First time I heard anything positive from a doctor. However, 9 month later I had a horrible stuck episode that took me to the ER where all the fill was removed. Oh, and right after surgery I had terrible left shoulder pain that he knew NOTHING about. MISTAKE NUMBER 6*. When I found this forum - It was just the lap band forum then - THEY HAD WHOLE THREADS DEVOTED TO LEFT SHOULDER PAIN!!!! Now to the part about the band itself: I lost 75 pounds but only 15 from the band. It never did one thing it was promoted as doing. It didn't decrease hunger, it didn't provide satiety, it didn't improve any of my medical conditions. It just made it difficult to eat - pain and pressure. So, it was the worst of both worlds. Couldn't eat but still felt hungry - like my bottom stomach was saying "hey, feed me- I'm still hungry" but I couldn't. I did not fail the band, I was a very compliant patient. The band failed me. I have been over in the sleeve forum - was contemplating getting a revision but decided it wasn't for me. I don't want to be the one who has daily diarrhea 2 years out and still can't drink plain Water, or who had pain for 2 hours from a crouton. Or has increased GERD, can't take NSAIDs for life (I have arthritis) and a whole host of other reasons, not the least of which the surgeon said I could lose "as much as 45 pounds". All that for MAYBE 45 pounds?? No thanks, I am in onderland, a place many on these boards Celebrate after surgery. So, I am going to live with this thing unless it causes a complication that requires removal. So, that's my story, sorry it was so long. Hope everyone else is doing well. *CAN BE INTERCHANGED WITH "RED FLAG NUMBER TWO, ETC.."

Thanks for your thoughtful reply. Yes, my original surgeon was an idiot. The doctor who I went to for the second opinion and with whom I stayed is now gone. After the stuck episode I had all the fill removed. I have gained back about 30 lbs from what I lost. But that gain has been mostly in the last 2-3 years and it was due mainly to stress eating due to an enormous stressful situation in my life (ongoing). The band never provided me with satiety. I was always hungry. That is a problem that I see repeated here and on the sleeve forums (lap band to sleeve). My second doctor said that many of his patients wanted more and more fills to maximize weight loss. That isn't healthy. I would still feel empty and unsatisfied when I ate and I couldn't eat more because of the pain and pressure. So, it was the worst of both worlds - not feeling satisfied, being hungry and having pain and pressure and a few stuck episodes - the one that took me to the ER was so painful I am sure getting shot could not have been worse. I couldn't even talk. While my current surgeon, my third, might "work the band" with me it is not something that I am currently considering. I don't want to go back to the experiences that I had before. I still get some left shoulder pain and that is my stop signal and I can sometimes struggle with the first few bites of food. And this is with an unfilled band. I had an upper GI in February and there was not a slip, a slight hiatal hernia and mild esophageal dysmotility (sp?). Overall, it was in the right position and looked fine. The main thing about the band is that it didn't cause me to lose weight. I didn't go through all I did for 15 pounds. This last reason is the main reasons many bariatric surgeons no longer do the band. The research does not support it as causing long term weight loss. I'm not sure how the sleeve is promoted but the band was promoted to help you lose 50% of your excess weight. So, if you're 100 pounds overweight and lose 50 pounds - you would still be obese. I am very happy for all of those on here who have had a lot of success with the band and I hope they continue to do so. But it wasn't the right surgery for me and I don't think the sleeve is at this time either. Thanks, again.

If you feel nauseated can your doctor prescribe something for nausea? Try to find one that doesn't cause drowsiness.

My surgeon's website even says that if you don't have 100 pounds to lose the risks of bariatric surgery outweigh the benefits. I've already been through one failed surgery so at this point in my life I am not ready to take that chance on a second one. Thanks for your reply.

#1 I want the lap band removed (placed in 2008 by different surgeon) but I am still struggling with the decision to get the sleeve. Ultimately I know the decision is mine and I have to do what I think is right but I'd like some practical (not philosophical) advice. To me the main purpose of any WSL should be to improve one's quality of life. If losing weight does that - great. If your medical conditions improve - great. If you can do things you couldn't do before - great. And finally - if you look and feel better - great. My band is unfilled now and I can eat most anything. It is a crap shoot though as to when I get stuck or feel very uncomfortable and need to make myself throw up. I also get left shoulder pain. I was diagnosed with GERD many years ago and have been on nexium for about 10 years - so I have no heartburn or symptoms of GERD despite reducing my nexium to 20 mg and only taking it every other day. During this time I have slept elevated. At age 64 I have chronic back pain and arthritis. Tylenol is not effective. My weight doesn't keep me from doing anything - more so the back pain and arthritis (neither of which improved with my weight loss with the band). So that brings me to my dilemma: I am at a BMI of 35 and the surgeon says I can expect to lose about 45 pounds. And I won't be able to take NSAIDS for life to treat my pain. I have also read that about 1/3 of those who didn't have acid reflux develop it after the sleeve. I have also heard the word "stuck" and vomiting with referral to the sleeve. Then there are all the foods (even healthy ones) that one cannot eat after the sleeve. So, I guess what I am trying to decide is if the sleeve will improve the quality of my life or create problems I don't have now without benefits to my medical conditions (that's asking a lot for 45 pounds). Any advice - especially from those who didn't have a lot of weigh to lose

Since I posted my original post I have done a lot more research on here as to the many outcomes and experiences that people have with the sleeve. Most are happy as clams, but when I read further it is because losing weight really changed their lives by making them healthier. They could now do things they couldn't do before. And many of their co-morbidities either improved or went away. And they look better and love that, too. So, because of this they put up with and tolerate the difficult side of the sleeve - they have regained their hunger; they have daily diarrhea two years out (or chronic constipation), they can't tolerate plain Water. They developed worsening GERD, they have sagging skin, they are depressed, they want to eat real food (some can, some can't), etc.. Everyone is different and there are NO guarantees with any WLS as to what YOUR experience will be. Getting healthier never happened to me when I lost 75 pounds with the band (only 15 from the band the rest was me dieting and the liquid only phases). My back problems are my biggest health problem and they got worse after the band. I spent most of 2012 in doctor's office trying to find out what was wrong with me. It took two trips to the ER to find out. Not being able to take NSAIDs for my back and arthritis (my surgeon told me this) is a big factor as is GERD. My husband died of esophageal cancer after having Barrett's esophagus so I know what GERD can do. I am in onderland now and will keep trying to lose weight by counting calories and exercising and using Alli. But for now, I am not doing the sleeve. Thank you, everyone, for your helpful replies. I wish you all continued success.

@@Bluesea71 Great post. I hope you enjoyed the cupcake. @@Nyelaah Couldn't agree more.

Since you mention arthritis you should know that some surgeons don't allow NSAIDS for life after the sleeve. And most OTC and prescription drugs that treat arthritis are in that family. Additionally, if you don't have GERD you can develop it post-sleeve and if you do have GERD the sleeve can make it worse. Also the research on the by-pass shows that it can eliminate GERD in many cases. As others have said - look on the sleeve and by pass forums for information on the pros and cons of each and good luck with your decision.

You are not the first one to post that they were struggling with weight loss, called their surgeon and basically was made to feel like it was their own fault. I am going to speculate why this is. I think the surgeons take this failure to lose weight as their failure or the failure of the WLS itself which they promote. So they don't want to even suggest that it is anything but you're fault. There is always a complaint process in every hospital. Call someone to find out what it is and complain to the right person. No one should be made to feel the way you were and leave in tears. Good luck.

That's great news that he is willing to go out. When I read the part about seeing a new colt - I was like "I want to go too". I think seeing a new colt would be awesome for anyone. Let us know how it went. But depression is well documented after any surgery. I remember after my mother had a major operation to receive a new aortic valve (she had an aneurysm) she became very mean and verbally abusive to my dad. She was not herself, either. Your body is healing, you can't do the things you used to do and like he said it's like losing your best friend (food). Give it time, see how it goes, but if it goes on too long, do seek professional help. The idea of seeing the psychologist who did he pre-op evaluation is a good start. Good luck.

@@Luvin_Life125 If this is a new, different or worse pain from what you have experienced before then you might need an MRI to see what is going on. You could have a herniated disk. If so, it can be surgically repaired rather than suffering until it heals on its own. I have multiple and chronic back issues and when I lost weight with the lap band my back problems not only didn't improve - they got worse. It can happen. Hope you get the help you need and feel better soon.

There seems to be some difference of opinion by some as to whether the band is meant to be permanent or temporary. While it can be removed or revised to a different WLS I am not aware of anyone in the medical profession, especially those putting bands in, saying that they are meant to be temporary. Would you have the band put in if you were told it wasn't meant to be permanent?

My dad was obese and he loved food. He was a gentle soul who had a good heart. He was a very generous person who didn't complain and worked hard. But he loved food. The only times I ever saw him in a bad mood was when my mother put him on a diet (she too was obese). I don't know if he knew the health risks of obesity but I will say that he enjoyed life and lived what was for his generation a normal life span. His weight never seemed to stop him from doing anything (perhaps his age did). I guess I am glad he chose to be happy.